Joel Osteen Makes No Apology For His Refusal To Preach On Hell Or Other Bible Doctrines

"You know, it's not hellfire and brimstone. But I say most people are beaten down enough by life," Osteen said in a special Easter edition of CBS Sunday Morning. "They already feel guilty enough. They're not doing what they should, raising their kids—we can all find reasons.

Joel Osteen, who is known for his effervescent personality and sunny disposition in nearly all matters, says he is not cheating people by not preaching about hell.

“But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him.” Luke 12:5 (KJV)

EDITOR’S NOTE: The number one reason why anyone should ever want to be saved can be summed up in one word – Hell. Because of Hell, Jesus went to the cross and made a payment to set you free if you would only take it. Because of Hell, God commands believers to take the message of salvation to a lost and dying world. What sends you to Hell? Unpaid sin in your life. But Joel Osteen refuses to tell people about Hell because he wants them to be “uplifted” and “feel positive”. 

“You know, it’s not hellfire and brimstone. But I say most people are beaten down enough by life,” Osteen said in a special Easter edition of CBS Sunday Morning. “They already feel guilty enough. They’re not doing what they should, raising their kids—we can all find reasons. So I want them to come to Lakewood or our meetings and be lifted up, to say, ‘You know what? I may not be perfect, but I’m moving forward. I’m doing better.’ And I think that motivates you to do better.”

Other pastors, however, believe fire and brimstone preaching may be what the church needs again.

“To the shame of much of today’s church, there has been a firm and steadfast rejection of any truth that doesn’t result in people feeling happy affection for God,”writes Pastor John Burton. “While a core message of mine has to do with enjoyable and permeating intimacy with Jesus, I understand that it is not a mutually exclusive one. That teaching when it stands alone, apart from the full counsel of God’s Word, produces a people who don’t understand the fear of the Lord, the severity of their lifestyle decisions or the intensity and nearness of eternity.”


Despite criticism, Osteen forges ahead.

“Our general message speaks to staying in peace and being respectful and staying full of joy and staying positive,” he tells “I don’t get specific about the politics, but our core message deals with [how] every day, you have to choose to be happy; you have to overlook things that are done wrong and things that are said.” source

Beware of the false New Age teachings of Joel Osteen



NTEB is run by end times author and editor-in-chief Geoffrey Grider. Geoffrey runs a successful web design company, and is a full-time minister of the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ. In addition to running NOW THE END BEGINS, he has a dynamic street preaching outreach and tract ministry team in Saint Augustine, FL.

  • larry w. grant

    Who else thinks Joel Osteen is a little light in the loafers? Doesn’t the Bible also say
    “Be ye not effeminate” also? Well Joel makes Barack Obama seem like Jock.

    • Yes Larry he just wants to get along, with everybody.

      • -Yeah Teresa and you’re not talking a friend like Jesus, because one of our first Gospel teaching about hell come from Jesus regarding Abraham’s Bosom Lk. 16:19-31, see more here,

        • Emery

          In Luke 16:23, it refers to Hades, not hell. Hades and Sheol are the “common grave of mankind”. A hell of fire and torment is fictitious. It does not exist. Check the original texts from one of the existing 5,000 scrolls in Koine. It says Hades, NOT hell. In fact, hell, or rather any word that could translate into hell, does not appear anywhere in the original texts/scrolls of the scriptures. Find a translation of the Bible that is actually accurate, and that will show you as well. But the original Koine texts are my preference.

          Jesus NEVER taught anything about hell, ever.

          • Edwitness

            In Mt18:9 Jesus seems to be putting together the idea of a fiery hell(Gehenna) does He not? “…rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire“. Jesus must be using the word figuratively here, right? Jesus referred to hell in His teaching frequently. So I am not sure why you would say He “never taught anything about hell, ever.” Unless you are rejecting the figurative use of these words. But, as you can see, even Jesus used Gehenna figuratively.

            Strong’s says Gehenna is used figuratively as a name for the place or state of everlasting punishment-hell. And from the references Jesus made, which are many, I am comfortable with Strong’s explanation in this case. Mt 5:22,29,30, 10:28, 11:23, 23:15,33, Luke 10:15, 12:5, 16:23

            The question is then, what does it mean when the scripture says “lake of fire” and “wailing and gnashing of teeth”? These are descriptions of an eternal place of torment. Rev14:11 And while it may be true that Hades and Sheol and Gehenna may literally mean something other than a fiery lake of torment, or hell, they have become synonomous with it just the same. Especially when we see Jesus using it in such a way.
            Mt 8:12, 13:42,50, 22:13, 24:51, 25:30, Luke13:28
            Jude7, Rev19:20, 20:10,14,15, 21:8

          • Emery

            Certainly not. Since Strong’s is based solely on the KJV, which is filled with almost 20,000 deliberately mistranslated words, one cannot rely on Strong’s or the KJV to know God’s words. Hell never appeared in the original texts. Gehenna is not hell. Hades and sheol are not hell. No hell of fiery torment even exists according to God’s word. It only exists in false translations of His word.

    • Pam

      Are you insinuating that Osteen is a homosexual? That is evil gossip straight from the pit of hell.

      • Pam,

        I would like to see members of the Church find another expression besides “pit of hell.” It’s excessive hyperbole; it’s overused, and weakens the true meaning of the term. How about just “gossip?” That’s all it is in reference to Osteen. People are turning it into a Christian cliche.

    • Betty

      We are to live by the entire Bible not just pick and choose. People are being miss lead by candy coating the Scriptures. There is only one way to be saved and that is through Jesus. Every part of the Bible is to teach us how to live and by whom we will be saved. God forgive someone who miss leads others because as a minister Joel is more responsible for his teaching then if he were a layman. Sure would not want to be in his shoes when he stands before the Lord.

      • Dee Dee

        Right on, Nancy! I agree with you! I used to listen and watch Joel all the time, but then I noticed some things he said that didn’t line up with scripture.

        • Dee Dee

          Right on, Betty! I agree with you! I used to listen and watch Joel all the time, but then I noticed some things he said that didn’t line up with scripture.

        • Dee Dee

          Sorry…I meant I agree with Betty…not Nancy!!!

    • Patrice

      I agree Larry.

  • Nancy

    I wish I could do as much as Joel Osteen does for the Body of Christ. I believe when He goes before the Lord, He will say, well done my good and faithful servant. Why can’t you stop putting down Pastor’s like you do? We are all God’s children and we are to love one another. Everyone who is born again, children of God, has a calling. God asks us to do what we know to do! Share the Word and love one another. God will take care of the rest. The body of Christ needs to come together, not divide and think more highly of yourself.

    • What “word” is Joel sharing? I have yet to find him teach one doctrine from the Bible….

      • dee money

        this is why the world is going to hell in a hand basket. jer.50:6 says, my people have been lost sheep, their shepherds have led them astray

    • Gary

      When joel was on Larry King live he refused to answer a direct question from Larry. ..if I don’t accept Jesus as a Jew am I going to hell? Joel said I’m not one to judge. ..what a lukewarm deceiver Joel is he is unfit to even teach a children’s Sunday school. .he is leading millions to hell through self help self promotion

    • Joseph Green

      Joel Osteen lost me when I saw him on TV say that there many paths to heaven and we do not need Jesus.

    • Leigh

      What Word? Joel is nothing more than a motivational speaker. He is not preaching the gospel that Christ Jesus preached. Watch the infamous clip of Joel and specifically Victoria Osteen where she says “When you come to church and worship God, you are not doing it for God, you are doing it for yourself”….that is utter blasphemy!

      • froggie

        Leigh-Also notice how many times they both throw out their 666 and horn hand signs. They are “NOT” Christian but satanist. And I don’t care if the truth offends people. I live for Christ Jesus and I’m not afraid to die for my precious Savior. So get over it !!

        • Leigh

          Yes I have seen that brother. I think they may not do it purposefully, but its the spirit of anti-Christ that works through them, on a sub conscious level perhaps?

          • froggie

            Amen sis!

      • John c

        Victoria also did that Jesus was born a man and when He was baptized He became God. There’s a term for that, but I can’t remember what it’s called. Either way, it’s heresy.

    • froggie

      Nancy, just by your comment, you expose your lack of knowledge of knowing God’s Word !! We need to be STUDIERS, not just READERS, to know what God’s Word really says… Test them by the Word of God…Our only protection against false teachers is to know the Bible our self. They emphasize prosperity and how to get God to bless you with money. They emphasize the love of God until you think His promises have no conditions. In short, they do not preach the whole Gospel. They select what makes them popular. They draw 50,000 people to their services a week. They keep writing books that sell and bring them millions. But can you trust them with your salvation? Ear-tickling preachers are loved by the world. In 2 Timothy 3, Paul recounted the persecutions and suffering he endured for the gospel—they were frequent and intense—and then said, “Indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted. Jesus said that the world would treat us the way it treated Him. But the world doesn’t hate ear-tickling preachers like Joel Osteen because they are “of the world” in their approach to the gospel. Why is he invited on TV shows like Oprah Winfry who said that there are many ways to heaven if he was a true disciple of Jesus ?? If he doesn’t repent, he will “NOT” hear, good and faithful servant. And if “YOU” don’t wake up, you will also follow the anti-christ because he will speak of “love only” like these false teachers.

    • Adam

      Joel is not fit to preach.
      How can you tell someone to recieve Jesus and be saved without telling them WHAT they need to be saved from?
      He doesnt preach on Hell because he doesnt believe what the Bible says about it.
      Everyone is NOT God’s children:

      Joh 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
      Joh 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
      Joh 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
      Joh 8:45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

      You have to love Jesus to be a child of God.
      How do you love Jesus?

      Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
      Joh 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me.

      To deny this is to deny Scripture.

      • froggie

        Well said my brother!!

      • Skywatcher

        Brother Adam, there’s no arguin’ with Scripture! That’s the long and the short of it! Well done!

    • Susan johnson

      Nancy is truly one of the Deceived….

      Truly comfortable in her deceit.

      What she does not realize, or maybe she does but denies it….is the fact that Jesus commanded us to:


      Use Discernment

      Nancy says she wishes she “could do as much as Joel Osteen does for the Body of Christ”….

      Such as denying that Hell is the eternal Lake of Fire…that many deceived will end up there…that Brimstone is straight out of God’s

      Repent of your statements and deceit, Nancy….for you do not have “all the time in the World”.
      Repent of your faithful following of Joel Wolf-in-Sheep’s Clothing Osteen, and come to the Knowledge of the Truth.
      Rent Now…or Perish.

      As Always–The Truth Shall Set You Free…

      • Joel Wolf-in-Sheep’s Clothing Osteen knows full well that if he were to preach on Sin, Hell, and Judgement, he
        would lose thousands of his deceived followers. This “feel-good” motivational speaking, being passed off as preaching,
        is not only what pays the bills, but also allows Joel, his wife, and extended family members to live in an over-the-top
        luxurious lifestyle. His Church members/followers would become so offended and hurt by the Truth, that they would disappear.

      • froggie

        Susan-Many that call themselves “Christian” are going to be left behind because of their lack of oil (Holy Spirit). They rather follow these wolves because it tickles their ears. They just love what they hear. The truth makes them uncomfortable and it’s not politacal correct. They love what the world loves:(

    • Nancy,

      While so much could be said, suffice it to say, Joel Osteen is a false teacher. Like Rick Warren and host of other modern day “preachers” he misuses the Holy Scriptures to serve his own purposes. Read the following quote by Osteen and note, he essentially redefined the Christian message.

      “When we believe in God’s Son, Jesus Christ, and believe in ourselves, that’s when our faith comes alive. When we believe we have what it takes, we focus on our possibilities”

      The gospel of God is that “which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord” Romans 1. It is not about “we”, it is not about “believe in ourselves”, it is not about “we have what it takes”, it is not about “we focus on our possibilities”. It is all about the saving work of Jesus Christ on the Cross for us, and that entails our union with Him in His death, burial and Resurrection. Please read the book Romans, specifically chapters 1 through 8.

      Jesus does not call us to “believe in ourselves”— He calls us to die.

      34 And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. 35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it. 36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? 37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul? 38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels. Mark 8

      18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written,

      I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
      and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.

      20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? 21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. 22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: 23 but we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; 24 but unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. 25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. 1 Corinthians 1

      1 Therefore seeing we have this ministry, as we have received mercy, we faint not; 2 but have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God. 3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 4 in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus’ sake. 6 For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. 2 Corinthians 4

    • Joel does nothing for the body of Christ. He builds the body of Satan by preaching a false gospel that does not save souls from hell. We are to confront sin and preach repentance, as Jesus and the apostles taught us to do. Everything else is a false gospel and a different Jesus. Our God is a God of love and mercy…but he is also a God of wrath and unfettered vengeance in his day. Those who don’t hear and heed the call to repentance will be in the wine press of the fierceness and wrath of God…yet Joel doesn’t care. He just wants them to be happy now and to buy his books. He is a wicked false prophet.

    • Terri Horn

      Do you know he has NEVER shared how to accept as what Jesus as Lord and Savior and that is what he told his disciples to do. what about his wife who said go to church cause it makes you happy. God wants us to be happy. I bet that is news to Jesus since he allowed his ONLY son to die in whom at is still the most horrific way possible. When Osteen comes before Jesus he will say depart from me I never knew you. by not preaching God’s word a lot of people will go to hell because of his preaching. He NEVER quotes from the bible just paraphrases the scriptures (as he calls it)I listened to him once and he should get down on his knees and tell God he is sorry before it is too late. oh he also believes everyone gets to heaven their own way and he supports a one world religion and that right there shows whose side he is on and his side looses.

    • kid

      Joel Osteen is not doing anything for the body of Christ, We put Pastor’s down who do not preach the whole message of Christ. Pastor’s who twist Scripture. Pastor’s who are afraid to speak out against homosexuality because they don’t want to offend people.
      We are not all God’s children, we are all God’s creation….know the difference. 1 John 5:1-5 says Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves Him who begot also loves him who is begotten of Him. 2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our[a] faith. 5 Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? So unless you believe Jesus is the Son of God, The Christ King, The risen Savior, you are not a God’s child.
      I do agree with your last two sentences though Nancy.

    • Jkittyc

      To give the pure gospel of Jesus Christ is our commission, for every person who is saved. It is not in my Bible to preach “you can feel better with a positive attitude” preaching. Never once have I read in my Bible that when you feel good you will go to heaven. Never once have I read in my Bible that a positive attitude will get you past the pearly gates. This is the kind of thinking that bypasses the fact that “YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN” TO ENTER THE KINGDOM OF GOD. I have never heard Joel Osteen say that you must be born again. Have you? I’ve never heard Osteen say that your sins will send you to hell. Have you?

      “Our message is broad,” says Osteen.
      Boy, he’s not kidding!

      Here is one of his biggest topics for the NIGHT OF HOPE:
      “I think one thing is people don’t believe in themselves. They have a negative recording playing in their mind,” he says.

      Believe in WHO? Not JESUS!

      “One persistent criticism of Osteen — who has a reported net worth of $40 million and lives with his family on a $10.5 million estate — is that he preaches a “prosperity gospel,” while Christ himself told followers to give up earthly possessions.”

      The details
      WHO: Joel Osteen and Victoria Osteen.
      WHAT: “A Night of Hope.”
      WHEN: 7:30 p.m. Friday.
      WHERE: Prudential Center, 25 Lafayette St., Newark.
      HOW MUCH: $15 (plus venue fees and taxes). At box office, or Ticketmaster outlets.

      And what REAL preacher of the Gospel charges money? LOVE offerings yes, that are given voluntarily as you feel led, & if you don’t feel led to give or have the money, you are not forced to pay.
      I’ll take my money to the classic theatre down the street for an old John Wayne movie.

    • Roger

      Well said Nancy. Personally I am not a fan of Olsteen. I agree with what others have said about him leaving out parts pertaining to hell. But nevertheless as in Acts when the disciples came across others teaching of Jesus they were not suppose to stop them from teaching TRUTH. Although I feel as others that Olsteen is just incomplete this does not justify me attempting to tear him down. We must lift one another up!!! Therefore when we disagree we pray. Just tell Jesus on each other and give God praise when He allows a door to open in our life that we can be a blessing to all that may be around us

      • Skywatcher

        Brother Roger, in all fairness to your post to Nancy, we need to keep a healthy balance. For you, a believer that may be well rooted in God’s Word and know the difference between sound teaching and that which isn’t, it is therefore imperative, that those of us who know the truth, get it out there, to prevent others from becoming victims to the half-truths (lies) that are being perpetuated by seemingly righteous men.

        It’s definitely not a matter of judging or “tearing down”, but it is an act of obedience on our part to expose the wolves in sheep’s clothing. When anything or anyone disagrees with God’s Word, we are NOT to pray, but to step up to the plate, and to move to action! We may need to pray for God’s guidance so that we do it in the right way, but that’s the only prayer required in a case like this.

        For the life of me, I cannot believe a soldier out in an arena of combat would suddenly put his sword/gun down as the enemy rapidly advances, and say to those around him, “Excuse me for a minute or two; I have to pray about this”! I’d be tempted to shoot the sucker and get him out of our way myself!

        That’s a mighty poor way of handling the Father’s business…to pray when we have already been given the directive as to what to do:

        “Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners,nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful,

        But his delight is in the law of the LORD: and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
        And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither: and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
        **The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
        Therefore, the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
        For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.** Psa. 1

    • Vicki sellers

      Nancy, while we are to love one another & come together in Christ we do still need to be discerning of others. That doesnt mean we dont love them, but scripture tells us to watch out for false prophets & to be discerning. To compare everything someone says, no matter how Godly they may seem, to what the Bible says. The things Joel Osteen has been preaching has a note of truth in it but at the same time is heavily sugar coated. I for one dont want my fellow brothers & sisters to be mislead & want them to go to Heaven, as I know you do as well. Godbless

  • kelliepage

    Osteen believes in the concept of “planting monetary seeds (in his church) begets personal wealth, thus happiness”. “If only I had a million dollars I would want for nothing”. He leaves out the Bible verse telling us it’s easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man get to Heaven. Some of the happiest people I know have next to nothing, so to me, Osteen’s principle rings false. It only proves other Bible verses true that some church leaders can steer folk straight to hell.

  • Tracy

    Joel Osteen is a motivational speaker, not a preacher of the Word. A true called by God preacher will preach/teach from the entire Bible, not just part of it.

    • That’s what I always said, Tracy. He’s a motivational speaker.

  • Andrea gaNt

    Ok. First of all mr Joel isn’t supposed to be anybody’s life coach. He isn’t mister sunshine. The word of GOD if he read it right says to spread the good news. Yes Jesus wants us to be happy but he doesn’t want us to be ignorant. We know he is the way to Heaven and everlasting life. And we don’t get there by singing I’m walking on sunshine. We get there by going to the father and asking for forgiveness through his son. He wants us to be realistic and know if we don’t accept him, we will have another place we will be spending eternity and that is hell or the lake of fire. He needs to get real and start preaching the Bible and not be so worried about being popular. He is leading people down the wrong path.

    • Can you please show me ONE verse where Jesus says He wants us to be happy?

      • “…the Peace that passeth all Understanding….in Christ Jesus”.

        • NOT MEANT to answer Mr. Griders rebuttal…the Peace is NOT happiness….it is exactly that…the Peace in Jesus
          Christ to those who, by Faith, have eternal Salvation…NOT happiness!!

      • Jkittyc

        You asked for it.

        1 Kings 10:8 Happy are thy men, happy are these thy servants, which stand continually before thee, and that hear thy wisdom.
        2 Chronicles 9:7 Happy are thy men, and happy are these thy servants, which stand continually before thee, and hear thy wisdom.
        Job 5:17 Behold, happy is the man whom God correcteth: therefore despise not thou the chastening of the Almighty:
        Psalm 144:15 Happy is that people, that is in such a case: yea, happy is that people, whose God is the Lord.
        1 Peter 3:14 But and if ye suffer for righteousness’ sake, happy are ye: and be not afraid of their terror, neither be troubled;
        1 Peter 4:14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.

        Those don’t sound like Joel Osteen at all.

        • Jkittyc

          Philippians 4:11 Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content.
          1 Timothy 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
          1 Timothy 6:8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content.
          Hebrews 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.


          1. satisfied with what one is or has; not wanting more or anything else.

        • Skywatcher

          Jkittyc, I’m happy!!! That was a good word! Thanks, for sharing, Sis! Too bad we couldn’t be in a permanent state of “happy”, though…without pills! If we were, God would not have the opportunity to teach us valuable lessons in the hard times in which we’re not quite so happy. There needs to be a balance.

          What a loving and mighty God we serve! God bless you! 🙂

        • Suzette Swanepoel

          Well done Jkittyc. ANyway, if one has “the peace that passes all understanding” in Jesus Christ, I cannot see how you can NOT be happy. To me peace equals happiness.

          • Skywatcher

            Try losing a loved one who didn’t personally know Jesus. Nothing happy about that! Christians are not happy all the time, as some would like to preach or believe.

  • Jesus preached on the doctrine of Hell more than the doctrine of Heaven, and yet, Joel Osteen deems it unfit to preach on? How can that be? Does he not know what salvation is? Salvation is being SAVED FROM HELL. So if you don’t preach on Hell, who is actually getting saved?

    “Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?” Matthew 23:33 (KJV)

    • Guest

      Amen, Geoffrey. Jesus made it abundantly clear that the life following Him would come with much suffering and tribulations. Didn’t he tell his disciples to pick up their cross? I will not try to ever describe what God or Jesus are thinking. My opinion is Happiness is for the flesh, but joy is for the spirit. This world is of sin and the flesh is of this world. What Joel Osteen is doing is twisting the scripture to line his pockets. Don’t quote me on this, but I believe his annual tithing collection is in the $60 million dollar range. I don’t remember reading about any true follower of Christ in the Bible doing it with intentions of financial gain. There will always be true believers that have more than others. It all belongs to God anyways! This is another great article and I applaud you for exposing men like Mr. Osteen for what they are doing. Using a twisted version of the good news to create fictional prosperity. People need to have an attitude of gratitude and just be grateful to live in this country where water and basic needs are abundant.

    • Yes he did….and Joel proves that he only cares about this world and making money by not preaching what we were warned about because hell and the wrath of God…is coming:

    • Scarlett

      Mr. Grider, have you communicated this to Mr. Osteen? Seems it would do more good to tell him, rather than just writing a blog. I’d almost bet he doesn’t read your blog.

      • I don’t think he cares one way or the other what people say about him. I wrote this story to warn Christians deceived by his false teachings in the hopes that some will wake up and get out of his “church”.

      • Howdy Scarlett, You can be certain that Joel Osteen knows what he is doing and without regret. He is greatly deceived and satan is using him to lead millions into perdition. As Skywalker put it, he is not the problem…it is the millions who are misled because they don’t read their Bibles enough to be able to discern GOD”S WORD from lies. Joel Osteen and all of the others like him serve as a “wake-up” call to the true church to be busy winning souls and making sure that THEY themselves are rapture-ready. And always remember…a half truth, which is what comes out of the mouth of Joel Osteen, is more dangerous than a blatant lie. That is one of the chief wiles of the enemy, and as Bible-believers who are obedient to CHRIST, we are obligated to point these deceptions out to our brothers and sisters who are too weak in the WORD to discern the difference. That is our mandate…and we do this in love, although it may not look that way. Blessings, BuffaloBilly

        • Tracy

          Amen!! He knows what he is doing. The love of money has marred his mind.

  • Don’t worry, be happy. Cause when you worry your face will frown. That will bring everybody down. don’t worry be happy. Look at me, I am happy. Compliments of Bob Marley school of life. This song kind of sounds familiar.

  • Andrea gant

    Well Geoffrey I believe Jeremiah 29:11 is one. I’m sure there are others. What is your point?

    • Read it in the king james. It’s totally different than in your modern version.

      • To be clear the “plans to prosper you” garbage was added in by Westcott & Hort in the 1800’s in order to change a promise about eternity in heaven with God, into a temporal, material one. They did that several times, because they didn’t believe in a biblical heaven, but they did believe in ca$h…just like Joel.

  • Andrea gant

    Love the song Teresa r. Sure it all sounds good when you hear it from a pulpit and everybody leaves happy but what if they don’t hear it right and when the leave they die in a car accident ? Poor lost souls on judgement day “well mr Joel osteen didn’t tell me about being saved or heaven and hell”. They deserve better. We all need to hear it whether we like it or not. Why should we walk around with our heads in the clouds thinking oh we we are saves and then we find out we re not cause we didn’t hear GOD s word the way it was meant to be told ?!

    • froggie

      AMEN Sister !!

    • Edwitness

      That is true Andrea gant,
      My mom used to listen to him and liked how nice he always seemed to be. I asked her if she ever remembered hearing him teach anything from the scriptures. She said she could not. We talked about how important it is for the pastor to teach from the word of God and after our conversation she stopped listening to him. The salvation message must be taught in such a way that the listener will know what they are in need of salvation ‘from’ as well as ‘to’. From death to life. From sin to righteousness. From wrath to peace. = from hell to heaven.


      • Skywatcher

        That’s an excellent word, Brother Edwitness! Keep up the great work! How are things going with Trent? Email me at when you get a moment! Love to hear from you, as would some others!

  • Jer. 29:11 is to the Jews in captivity in Babylon. Jeremiah spoke it through God. Geoffrey’s point is Jesus never mentioned ANYTHING about being happy. His point remains valid.

  • Andrea gant

    Well I guess we all can be miserable old coots then can’t we joe?

    • Yes Andrea, you said it. If no one tells a person there is a road to heaven or hell they will be lost, not saved. The gospel must be preached for all will be judged. Being a teacher a higher standard is required. Handling the HOLY Bible, the Word of God is not to be taken as a snack. A snack will not last long,(be happy), the whole counsel of God must be consumed to make it to the next life in Christ.

  • Its about fame, power and money in his best life now. The Bible uses the word saved many times. Saved from what? Hell. The old timers had it right when they ask” Are you saved?”

  • shelly

    Well Jesus did say thst he came that we’d have life and have it more abundantly. So of course he is about life and happiness, not oppression, depression, & misery. Of course we probably will not ALWAYS be happy, that doesn’t mean that Jesus wants us to be unhappy or enjoys it when we’re unhappy. Jesus tells us to fear not , have faith, etc so of course he wants us to feel hopeful, encouraged, strong, and not unhappy and w out hope .

    • Leigh

      ‘Life and have it more abundantly’, is referring to ETERNAL life, not the few passing years we have on this earth. Of course Jesus doesn’t want you to be unhappy but He never claimed we will live victorious, trouble free lives. Preachers like Joel Osteen forsake the true Word of God to make you feel good about yourself and life. The ‘Good News’ is that Jesus came to die for our sins and give us life Eternal with Him and the Father in heaven, not to drive a new car and accomplish all our earthly goals!

    • Dan

      Us Americans are the most selfish people in the world, we want what we want and we want it now! Jesus said that “as they have hated me they will also hate you for my name sake” also ” the servant is not greater then the master” just look around the world and OPEN YOUR EYES and see what’s happening to Christians! Maybe Joel could go to the Middle East and preach his message to those Christians, “don’t worry be happy” as Islam cuts the heads off their children, or whole villages of Christian are murdered, Folks these people have giving all and are the Saints Under God’s Alter saying when Oh God will our blood be avenged!
      Go sell this prosperity crap to the people around the world that don’t even know where their next meal will come from, Oh have a need plant a seed!

      • froggie

        DAN-Preach it brother!! I myself have been persecuted and even hated by some to this day. My sin?? I left the Catholic cult and gave my whole life to Jesus. I claim no religion just a relationship with my Savior. I personally see no happiness in this sin drenched world. My joy is in my heart to know that right now this is my hell but soon I’ll be in the arms of my Prince.

  • Albert

    The Bible is filled with good news and bad news, and neither one was meant to be taught without the other. Blessings and curses. It is what it is. You cannot just teach lovey-Jesus and protecting angels without warning them of the enemy who wants to kill, steal, and destroy. One without the other is a comfortable lie. The Bible says in Matthew 5:12 to “work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. 13For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure.” The truth is, it’s good to have a healthy fear of the Lord. Just like we feared a parent or guardian when we were children. There was still love, but when we did wrong there were consequences. Learning about God must include more than just feeling good and happy all day. There is joy and happiness, yes, but God isn’t a drug you can take at random to feel groovy.

    • GRACE

      amen albert 🙂

  • susan morrow

    Happiness is embodied in the commandment to love one another and God.
    If you don’t have love you are like a clanging gong

  • Donna R Brown

    Yes, Susan Morrow, we must love one another. And I believe that if we’re only preaching happiness, joy and prosperity without the truth of the gospel and eternity, we aren’t loving them.
    To truly love someone means you care enough to want to see them go to heaven, not hell.
    I’ve never been happier than when I first knew my name was written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. I’m not gonna whisper sweet nothing’s in people’s ears, I’m gonna tell them the truth about Jesus. Then they can find the true joy that lasts forever and not just the insta-joy you get from Joel’s prosperity speeches.

    • Great word Donna! If we don’t confront sin, then we don’t love them. I needed to see my sin before I could be saved.

      • Edwitness

        Sola Scriptura,
        My salvation experience was a little different. When I was made aware of how much God loved me, it was overwhelming to me. I thought “He died for me?” In my mind I could see no way anyone would pass on such an awesome gift of love. This is what drew me to the Lord. His love.

        Drinking, carousing, and the language I used, came in line with the kind of morality I thought I knew God wanted. As I grew in my relationship with my savior I discovered that, while He was indeed concerned with my behavior, mostly because of my Christian witness, He was even more concerned with the relationship itself. And when all is said and done, the relationship (righteousness Gal 3:21) we have with Jesus is what gains us enterance into His kingdom. It will be who we know, not what we know that gets us in.

        That is why He will say to those who did not come to a saving faith, “I never knew you. Depart from me you that work iniquity.”
        And also why Jesus says in John 17:3 “And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.” This is what makes the sin of idolatry the most agregious sin. And the only sin that we go to hell for.

        It is the sin the Holy Spirit has been sent into the world to convict the world of. John 16:9 “No faith in Me.” We do not know Jesus.
        When we do not trust in Jesus as God we make something else our God. Which is idolatry. Fix the idolatry problem and all the rest will come together as we live in relationship with Jesus.

        I am pretty sure that Mr. Osteen has not yet come to this relationship with the savior. And that is why he can’t teach about such a relationship. I pray he will before it is too late for him.


  • Robert Gabriel

    Those of you who know how to preach about hell why don’t you go a head and preach. You have become judges and that’s what so many of you are good at doing these days. You know why United States is becoming more and more godless society? Too many hypocrites and pretenders who sees nothing but faults in other people. I’m not surprised now to see the most racists group of people in this country are Christians. If you know how to preach, get your own church.

    • Mr. Grider and his Street Evangelist Team do just that…PREACH. The Gospel…the Good News.

      Jesus didn’t hint that we should Judge the actions and attitudes of others.

      He didn’t ask that we should Judge those same actions and attitudes.

      He COMMANDED US to Judge others…in Love and Compassion for our fellow Man.

      John 7:24.

      Know why the US is really becoming more and more a Godless society? Because people are not called out for their
      ongoing deliberate unrepentant attitudes and lifestyles. It’s called REBELLION…hand in hand with PRIDE…walking
      along with IDOLATRY.

      A Church building is not necessary in order to preach the Gospel….hence Mr. Grider and his Team.

      Your Wrath is inappropriate….Self Control is one of the Fruits of the Holy Spirit.

    • froggie

      Robert-Correction,America has become more and more Godless because of the televangelist,prosperity teachers and people like you. Calling true believers hypocrites and racist only exposes who you really serve. I think you have some hidden sins that makes you very uncomfortable about hell.Ouch!!

    • We are actually told by Jesus Christ himself to judge, not as hypocrites, but righteously, in accordance with the word. Paul even confronted the great apostle Peter publicly, when Peter was in the wrong. Why? Because the only thing that matters is the truth of God, not the reputations of men. Paul, too was not offended when the Berea’s tested everything he said with the scriptures. So…why should Joel O. or anyone be offended?? It’s not about them, it is about Jesus Christ and his blood shed on a cold hard cross for me and you:

      • Skywatcher

        Amen, Bro! It’s all about Truth, and truth is Christ! John 14: 6 🙂

    • Angelgirl

      You know….there are many people in the world who confuse the meaning of “Judging”. To judge means to pass sentence. We are to point out sin. The Bible clearly states who will not see the kingdom of God so when a Christian does point out sin, it is in warning…as stated in Ezekiel 3:18-19 King James Version (KJV)

      18 When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.

      19 Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.

      In order to love Jesus, you must also keep His Word. Not to call out someone’s sin is to not only put their soul in jeopardy…but your own. It helps to know what the Word says and to understand it.

      BTW, you say Christians judge but is that not what you are doing yourself? Except that you are judging Christians for trying to live the way God commanded…so don’t bear false witness…unless what a person is doing is against Scripture and you have to KNOW Scripture to know that!

      • Skywatcher

        AMEN, Angelgirl! That’s a good word!

      • Ohh, Angelgirl, Very Impressive reply-succinct and to the point. I wish I could have said that. Will you go steady with me….BuffaloBilly

  • Larry/vietnamvet1971

    with a 30,000 seat Arena, Hugh crowds, money flowing, you are the Star, Center of Attention….who could give up this Gig he is addicted to it and it PAYS good.

  • DC

    I googled Joel Osteen books and found 131. Most of them have “you” in the title. It’s all about you having a better life; sounds a lot like Scientology to me. The first time I saw a book with his picture on it and saw that cheesy smile, it reminded me of the stereotype of the used-car salesman.
    I also remembered that a few years ago on a plane Victoria was acting very arrogant toward the flight attendant and actually said, “Do you know WHO I AM?” That showed me her true character right there.

    There’s nothing wrong with encouraging people to work harder, do better, feel better, but when it completely takes our eyes of God, the pastor’s role becomes one of cheerleader and not soul saver. If it’s all about me, where is there room for HIM?

    The Gospel is pretty simple if you think about it: we are sinners destined for hell in need of a Savior. God sent Jesus as the ultimate Lamb Sacrifice for us. We must admit our sin, turn away from it, and accept what Jesus did for us. Focusing on the “me” implies we can save ourselves, which is works and not faith.


    • froggie

      Thank-you brother for posting this video. Luke 18:8 “I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?”

  • Mike

    Have you seen Joel’s latest book, “The Power of I AM”? Luke 21:8 “And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come “in my name,” saying, “I AM” Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.” I believe he has the largest church in the US. He comes in the name of Christ and says “I Am.” Take heed that ye be not deceived!


    It’s sad that so many are being led astray by false doctrine and that so many can’t see past their own needs or wants, they do not see what the Lord’s will is for their lives and choose to follow His way. It is not preaching on hell or how Jesus is the only way that has caused this world to become the way it is as one commenter suggests but it is a lack of hearing this message because people are indeed turning away from sound doctrine and looking for teachers that tickle their ears. I praise God for every preacher I hear that is preaching and teaching from the entire word of God, they are following the Lord Jesus Christ, their flocks may be small in comparison but that’s ok with them, they are where the Lord Jesus Christ has them and they obey Him and they are a blessing to many. God bless and keep you!

  • Diane

    I used to watch him when I was a “Baby Christian,” but when I heard him say that doing God’s will should be ONE OF the most important things you do. One of, Joel? The Bible clearly says in Matthew 7:21 that “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.”

  • guest

    Joel Osteen is to Christianity what a Muslim who shouts “We’re peaceful!” is to islam.

  • nate

    chapter & verse where we’re supposed to be “happy”?? Jesus wants us to be “holy”. and joel’s claim of “your best life now”?? haha what a joke. try this PROMISE of God’s for us :

    “These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.” ‭‭John‬ ‭16:33‬ ‭KJV‬‬

    • robimac

      I bet a lot of nonbelievers read that book of his. I just have one thing to say about that. If you’re a nonbeliever, this IS your best life now. Whoa to Joel!

  • Mary vett

    I am amazed at the comments on this sit. Everyone is negative. The last thing he says is to get into a Bible based church.

    I cannot believe there are so many who think they have the right to judge.

    The sermon on the Mount did not speak of hell, it was full of love and hope. That is why churches are empty so much said on the wrongs of life and nothing to give hope.

    You have Sunday school to learn doctrine and Bible study classes. I bet not manyof you with your nasty comments even go to church. Living for Christ is every day and Sundays are his day. Do you shop, do you go to ball games. Concerts, to the beach ect. Do you shop like any other day? Does the TV blair? Are you golfing? Fishing? Hello, unless that day is kept sacred I would suggest you let the Lord take care of Joel and you sweep up your own back porch.

    • Pam

      Mary He also gives the Gospel after every sermon. I could no attend Lakewood because I hunger for solid food from a pastor teacher but that is a choice every believer positive to God’s word has to make. Do the people on this site not understand that God does the promoting? Being critical of Gods actions only brings discipline to the person doing it. There is either a serious lacking of Bible doctrine coming from the comments on this site or complete ignorance of grace. Never forget to work out your own salvation with fear and trembling first before you judge others, especially pastors, whom OUR LORD PROMOTES. When you are attacking Osteen you are attacking God’s decisions.

    • Howdy Mary Vett, Your comments are interesting and one of 3 on this strand that accuse the brethren. Matt 7:1-2 allows Christians to be judgmental…just to be careful in how they judge. Verses 3-5 apply to your “judgmental” statement at the end of your post. Maybe the comments are negative because the truth about Joel O’Steen is not positive. Mary, the churches are all empty because people want to hear the good stuff about the Bible and GOD…they run from the idea that GOD will judge them all one day…as he will you…as he will me…and all the others on this site as well as all those who wanted to have their “ears tickled”. Show me in one context of any Joel O’Steen message where he preaches on THE FEAR OF THE LORD which GOD says in Proverbs-is the beginning of wisdom. I challenge you, that when you read your Bible, that you underscore and note every verse that mentions THE FEAR OF THE LORD. Eventually, a picture and message will take place…one that is from THE LORD to YOU..and you will climb off of your judgmental seat and apologize to all these people on this site that you have maligned.Doctrine is not to be confined to Sunday School and Bible classes, but should be in the pulpit. Pastors are to preach the whole council of GOD, not just the part that enlarges the church’s coffers. That means that Bible prophecy, sin, hell and judgment belong in the pulpit where all the congregation can hear them…not just a select few in a Sunday school class. Mary, your last paragraph is straight from the father of lies and truly reveals the depth of YOUR deception…and btw…is very negative. O’Steen’s church is NOT Bible-based. If it was, then all these posts would not be here because Joel O’Steen would be preaching GOD’S WORD in its entirety. He is clearly NOT getting his “flock” ready for the rapture. Mary, are YOU getting yourself ready for the rapture or just nursing a Jezebel spirit…Lastly, if you know your Bible the way that you profess, then you will know that satan is the accuser of the Brethren…and your post is filled with accusations that have no real merit. The love of GOD is clearly not evident.
      Kindly, BuffaloBilly

      • DC

        Hey, BB, where’ve you been?
        Amen to your excellent post!

    • How can Joel Sheep-in-Wolves-Clothing Osteen tell Americans to get into a Bible based Church….

      When he does not know the Bible?

      When he deliberately twists Scripture (coached ) in order to boost motivational book sales?

      When he hems and haws during serious interviews which he agreed to do?

      When, even worse, he refuses to answer honest and legitimate Biblical questions?

      Here’s the Truth: Joel Osteen has no formal training/instruction in Biblical Studies/Theology.


      Joel Osteen was the Audio/Visual Director for his father. When his father suddenly died, Joel took over.


      Again–Jesus COMMANDED US to Judge our fellow man. Not hinted around, not asked.

      Remember…Repent Now of defending this Wolf. Of following the false teachings of this Wolf.

      The Truth Shall Make You Free…Free Indeed!

      • froggie

        LOL!! Preach it sister !!

        • Tracy

          @Susan Johnson,
          I have read all the above about Joel. He was the behind-the-scene audio/visual guy for his Dad.

          Also, do any of you remember in the mid-2000’s at the end of his telecast at the bottom of the TV screen, there would be an ad that would say, “Tickets on Sale ……… Call……….to reserve tickets.” Tickets on sale to hear and see Joel in other areas as he was becoming famous. I had never before heard of having to purchase tickets in order to see/hear a preacher. After that, I never again listened to Joel Osteen.

      • Skywatcher

        Amen, sister Susan Johnson! I second froggie’s motion: You preach it, sister! 🙂 It’s time Christians woke up, and really know what God’s Word has to say about these important matters of the soul! It’s past time we start calling a sheep a sheep and a wolf a wolf! God has just about had His fill of this modern mess called the “gospel”. These people are being led to the slaughterhouse and don’t even realize it. Very sad!

    • Angelgirl

      Actually, Saturday is the Sabbath not Sunday. It was the Catholics who changed it…God didn’t.

      Please don’t confuse judgment for calling out sin. The world is full of preachers who tickle the ears of people with a feel good message. Our ‘HOPE” is following Jesus and making it to heaven. Our “HOPE” is serving Jesus daily…our “HOPE”is the Word of God and not some preacher telling lies.

      I happen to be in church EVERYDAY. You see, I talk about the Lord EVERYDAY and the Word says where two or more are gathered in My Name, I am in the midst. A church is a building…real church is in the heart.

      For me and my house, the Holy Spirit teaches us…I don’t believe in “church doctrine”. I believe in the Word of God. If something can be backed up by the Word, then it’s truth and calling out sin can be backed by the Word. Try Ezekiel 3:18-19.

      Sweep off our own back porch? Name me on perfect person besides Jesus? We are to both admonish and encourage one another. I suggest you study the Word and quit griping about those who are acting BY THE WORD.

      • Skywatcher

        Angelgirl, may I lovingly correct a couple of points you made in your almost excellent post to Mary Vett? I’m going to assume you said, “yes”, and move into them. 🙂

        First of all, the church is not a building; it is the people. The building is merely the meeting house for the Church family.

        You said, “For me and my house, the Holy Spirit teaches us…I don’t believe in “church doctrine”.”

        There are a couple of ways to take “I don’t believe in “church doctrine”, and I’d like some feedback from you, to clarify your position, if you don’t mind. I think we’re on the “same page”, but your statement was pretty vague, and I’d like to know for sure. As members of God’s family, we are to be our brother’s and sister’s keeper, watching their back, so to speak.

        Were you referring to the teachings of the Church? the teachings about and surrounding the Church? or to Biblical doctrines in general?

        If it was the latter, I believe you would be shocked to realize just how much doctrine you do believe, and how it affects your daily life. If we have no place in your life for doctrine, then we have no place in our life for God’s eternal and inerrant Word.

        To a born again child of God, doctrine should be of utmost importance. Why? you or others may ask. Good question! II Tim. 3: 16, 17 gives us the answer:

        “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17. That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

        Doctrine is the tool that the Holy Spirit uses to equip us for a successful and safe journey in Christ, and it also equips us for ministry, one to another. Doctrine is like a “Driver’s Handbook” for beginning drivers. It provides the rules to ensure they and all others around them will be safe. It gives them direction and knowledge as to what signs to watch for, and why they are vitally important in their driving experience.

        Angelgirl, you may already know this, and if so, good. There are others reading this who will benefit from this post or God would not have directed me to write it.

        God bless you abundantly today, as you seek to serve Him with truth and joy!

        • Howdy Skywalker, How are you today, my Brother. I apologize for being a “buttinski” but Angelgirl and I are going steady and I have to come to her defense. I think she was referring to denominational doctrine–not church doctrine. I too have issues with denominational doctrine and we witness it at times on this site. One thing for sure…she knows how to “cut to the chase” and make it stick. Love It! That’s why I asked her to go steady with me. I am so very blessed… Kindly, BuffaloBilly

          • Skywatcher

            BuffaloBilly, you crazy weiner! I was reading your post and really getting caught up in it, and then…I almost choked on my chicken! Yes, I did! I was eating my supper and then I heard your heart-wrenching plea to Angelgirl to go steady with you! I had to read it again! Why, you’re just full of surprises aren’t ya!

            I’m very well today and I got lots accomplished. It was nice and sunny outside, and I spent several hours out in it.

            As for denominational church doctrine, there is a place for the distinctives, providing they align with God’s Word. At present, I’m still not sure where she was going with her statement. She may have posted me, but I just got home after a meeting, and I haven’t had a chance to read almost 40 posts yet! Lately, I don’t get much time to check out many new posts that Geoffrey is putting up. I’m going to leave you now, my brother, and check some of this mail out! God bless you with a great night! See you soon! 😉

  • Pam

    I don’t have a problem with presenting the facts. However, I will say be VERY careful how you judge Joel Osteen and opine on his motives as a pastor, lest you be judged and disciplined in the same manor. God promotes whom HE promotes and HE takes down whom He chooses. The Lord does the disciplining, and He doesn’t need idiot sheep, that can’t even come out of the rain, to do it for Him, Where is the grace that we are supposed to show other believers? Try praying for Him.

    • Oh Pam, “…HE doesn’t need idiot sheep that can’t even come out of the rain, to do it for Him” is such a judgmental statement. Maybe you should practice what you preach, ma’am. Nope–no grace in that statement. As I told another contributor, Matthew 7:1-2 gives every Christian the right to judge…just to be careful with that judgment. Truly, GOD’S WORD is the ultimate judge in all this. Well, here is a shocker…satan promotes too. That is why we have so many “wonderful” politicians and world leaders…and terrorists around us. Clearly, Joel O’Steen is a wolf in sheep’s clothing that JESUS warned us about, and he does bring another gospel (good news), but not one that will keep people out of eternal damnation. My guess is that satan is his with all the other “pastors” in the prosperity/word of faith movement. They worship mammon, not GOD. You know, Pam, deception is so powerful at times that the “idiot sheep” may not even know that they are the “idiot sheep’! Fodder for thought… You are correct in one thought…we should be praying for Joel O’Steen…and the “idiot sheep”…Blessings, BuffaloBilly

  • Southern Belle

    Wow, Mary vett, with all due respect I must point out that you are in serious need of studying your Bible and learning to “rightly divide” the Word of God! First of all, the Sermon on the Mount is directed to a Jewish audience who were still living under the law! Sure, there’s some spiritual application to be drawn from it by the church, but it is physically a Jewish message. For example, Jesus tells them if their eye or hand offends them that they must cut them off rather than be thrown into hell, right? While there’s some spiritual application for the Church here concerning the avoiding sin, the fact is that today, in this Church Age of grace, you can cut all your offending limbs off but if your heart has not been circumcised by the circumcision made without hands, you will still be headed for for an eternity in hell. That’s just one example. And I haven’t even begun to respond to your comments concerning the Sabbath! There really is no message of “hope” in the Sermon on the Mount” or much at all in the four Gospels, but the message of hope begins to come into full view as we get midway into the book of Acts and the Apostle Paul is converted and he begins to bring the full message of the Gospel of Jesus Christ to us, teaching the death, burial, resurrection, and faith in the shed blood of Jesus Christ as our hope for salvation, justification, sanctification, reconciliation, etc. Paul and John both also taught in the NT that if anyone brings a different Gospel than the one we have learned, we are to have nothing to do with them, to not let them into our house, nor to even bid them Godspeed. The fact is that Joel Osteen brings a different Gospel (which is NO Gospel) than the one taught by Paul and many under him throughout the last half of Acts, Romans, the epistles, etc. Discernment is such an important part of being a Christian. It comes from alot of prayer and a ton of Study of scripture, rightly dividing and understanding what’s being said and to whom it’s being directed. Context is everything!

  • Karen

    Mary vett, I agree. Didn’t we just do a trashing round on Joel Osteen a month or so ago. Why are we doing this again? How do we know what God has called him to do in these days? My Sunday School teacher told me I needed to work in the church nursery to be holy. That isn’t what God called me to do at that time. He called me to be still and write a book. Not everyone agreee, but I prayed and God guided me. I did what I felt I was called to do. Maybe the case with Joel Osteen. He always asks at the end of his sermons to invite Jesus as the Lord of your life. Maybe he is here to bring joy and hope to a world full of calamity. And to say “he’s light in the loafers.” Why because he seems genuinely happy and at peace with God and his life. All members of Christ’s body are meant to fulfill a unique and different role. Everyone has a part to play to glorify God. Not ours to judge. Come on people. This is getting to be too much. Does it make you feel better about yourself to criticize all these preachers? I guess I would ask the question, What are you doing for God these days?” Usually the ones who criticize the most are the ones doing the least.

    • Why are we doing this again?

      There is a limit on the number of times we are to warn others of these false preachers?

      There is a limit on the number of times we are to call out the greed, the rebellion, the deceit?

      God has NOT called Joel Osteen to do false preaching in these days. God would never ordain a false
      preacher such as Joel Osteen to lead the lost even further into Perdition and the Lake of Fire.

      WHERE is your DISCERNMENT? Or have you not?

      He is NOT at peace with God and his life. He is at peace with his mega million dollar income….and his mansion behind locked gates with an elaborate security system and personal bodyguards…..and his contentious disdainful wife…
      and his motivational book sales.

      Be Ye Not Deceived!

    • Peter and Paul didn’t mind having their teachings tested with scripture, so why should Joel be offended??

  • NATe

    mary vett, please EXPLAIN to us what this COMMANDMENT means?:

    “Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.”
    2 Timothy‬ ‭4:2‬

    im also reminded of this:

    “Open rebuke is better than secret love.”
    ‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭27:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

  • Southern Belle

    Karen, the Bible says “he that is spiritual judgeth all things”.

  • robimac

    He will pay dearly with his soul for his part in paving the way to hell for the multitudes who follow him. Whoa to him!

  • DC

    I just went to his website and did some searches. For “hell” he talked about people going through a personal hell on earth and of Jesus saving us from hell (but not how/why He does it or what we need to do). There is nothing in my search for “lake of fire.” Their “What We Believe” page says

    “the entire Bible is inspired by God, without error and the authority on which we base our faith, conduct and doctrine,” yet they avoid teaching about hell, which, as Geoff stated, Jesus talked more about than Heaven.

    The page also says
    “Jesus died on the cross and shed His blood for our sins. We believe that salvation is found by placing our faith in what Jesus did for us on the cross. We believe Jesus rose from the dead and is coming again.”
    There is nothing there that says you have to admit you’re a sinner…

    • Marian

      Rev. 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone…”

      verse 25, “And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.”

      • Marian

        So I guess Joel Osteen doesn’t read the whole Bible 😉

  • Laura L

    I watch a lot of different shows on VTN and Daystar, the two channels available in my area. Some of them are very good and truly do preach the gospel of Jesus Christ. I tried watching Joel Osteen on Daystar one night and I felt nothing. Usually a really good preacher can inspire me to take notes while they are giving a sermon. Charles Stanley and Michael Youssef give wonderful sermons on their shows. But Joel Osteen was like a balloon, for he was full of hot air. He never preaches about Jesus, always God. You know else does that? Mainstream Hollywood in their television shows and movies. They consider something to have a “religious” theme if they mention God, but never Jesus. Osteen is the same way. He’s preaching to an audience that has itchy ears.

  • Skywatcher

    Folks, I just finished reading ALL the comments and it comes back to two things:

    Joel is NOT the problem! The people are! They’re obviously too lazy to read God’s Word on their own time, to see what it really says, and to discover where he is wrong. If they were doing this, his arena would be almost empty! One doesn’t have to go to church to read about Heaven or Hell, but it *most definitely should be taught there!**
    “Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 21. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in they name done many wonderful works? 23. And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” Mt. 7: 20-23

    God’s will is that all of the counsel of His Word should be preached and obeyed!

    “For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God. 28. Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. 29. For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. 30. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. 31. Therefore, watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.” Acts 20: 27-31

    On Judgment Day, I wouldn’t want to be Joel. We cannot and dare not argue with God’s Word! Joel is without excuse!

    This is what happens when people rise up to be pastors without strong theological training on doctrines and other aspects of God’s Word. They brag about being students of the “School of the Holy Ghost”, and are proud that they never went to a proper formal Conservative Bible College or seminary, and this is what we get! Pastors that are weak or totally dead in the doctrines of God’s Word; the blind leading the blind…headed to a ditch near you!

    • Howdy Skywalker, Nice to hear from you again. AND…as usual, your astute observation rings so very true. What an indictment to all those people who follow O’Steen and his ilk. Makes Matt 7:13-14 ever so true. GOD Bless you my brother. I will look forward to more of your posts…and now I have to be very, very careful of what I say…In CHRIST, BuffaloBilly

      • Skywatcher

        Brother BuffaloBilly! Sooooo good to hear from you! Amazingly, just before I got to your post in my email, I was thinking of you! Yesiree, Bubba! I was musing how I hadn’t heard from you as of late, and thought you might be out chasin’ the big bass around the stream! Then I thought of how you were getting weary, and maybe just took a little break from it all. Good to have you back in the traces!

        Thank you, for the compliment, and yes, we will ALL have to be “very careful” about what we say!

        Merciful! You’re definitely making up for any lost time in knocking the demons to the ground in agony! As usual, you’re posts are extremely well balanced with God’s word, careful observation, and tempered with love and grace! Keep up the great work, my dear brother! It’s almost quitting time! 🙂 Your eternal brother in Christ, Skywatcher God bless you!



  • DC

    I will amend that I just did a search for “sinner’s prayer” and there was a good article on salvation there, which I was happy to find, but I still think we are in an age where we have to think about heaven and hell. It’s time to get off the milk and have some meat. I don’t hate the Osteens, but I do think they, like many others, are preaching too much prosperity and mushy stuff and not enough about the seriousness of the day in which we find ourselves. Joel also will not preach against homosexuality, which is definitely in the bible he loves. Yes, hate the sin & love the sinner, but also help the sinner turn away from that sin.

  • Karen

    Wow Susan, so much judgement and anger. “He is NOT at peace with God and his life. He is at peace with his mega million dollar income….and his mansion behind locked gates with an elaborate security system and personal bodyguards…..and his contentious disdainful wife… and his motivational book sales.” Sounds like jealousy to me.

  • Am I a dog’s head?

    No, Joel, most people are not feeling guilty ENOUGH! And the beat down they get by life is nothing compared to eternal damnation.

  • Marian

    Joel Osteen is wrong when he claims people feel guilty. I submit that guilty feelings often lead to repentance and I don’t see massive repentance in the Laodicean churches of America.

    Many “happy” people are on the road to Hell. Telling them “don’t worry, be happy” is cruel.

    Proverbs 27:6 Faithful are the wounds of a friend; but the kisses of an enemy are deceitful.

    • Skywatcher

      Sister Marian, I believe J.O. is correct when he claims people feel guilty! They definitely do “feel guilty”, but he doesn’t teach them the way of confession and repentance, as you and I believe God’s Word instructs, encourages, and expects us to do.

      I’m with you! I’ve heard a song a lot lately by the gospel group, “Signature Sound”. It says, “God’s people are happy people, happy all of the time”. My heart was broken and I was having a very difficult day when I first heard that song. Immediately, I recognized the lie within that very nice up-beat song. God’s people are not happy all the time, and nor are we expected to be so!

      We even have to listen ever so carefully to the lyrics of many “Christian” songs now! Many of them are being written by composers who go to these false churches. For a dear poor soul, who may be new to the faith (or others), after hearing that song, it could derail them spiritually, causing them to believe they aren’t even saved!

      I’m surprised nobody has picked them up on that yet. Hmmm…I might just have to do that! Thanks for the inspiration, Marian! God bless you!


    True love for others is in the message of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Though many find the offer of forgiveness of sin and the escape from the wrath of God offensive, it is the only offering we have to give.

    True Christian “love” is this:

    “Love worketh no ill to his neighbour…” (Romans 13:10)

    To not give the full message is the most hateful thing anyone can do. This goes for every “positive confessor”, prosperity preacher, the Pope, and all the other false ministers of Satan. They are the most dangerous people on earth.

    “If I hated you, I wouldn’t tell you about Jesus!” (my opinion)

    You can never be saved until you know you are lost…and you will never grow in your love for Jesus until you know how lost you were. (my opinion also)


    • Tracy

      Amen!! Mike. It’s love for others that causes Christian’s to want to tell others about Jesus. Like you, if I didn’t care about lost souls, I wouldn’t mention Jesus or hell either. I’m afraid with Joel, it’s all about money. Our bible speaks about this too.

    • Skywatcher

      Amen, Brother Mike W! You said, ““If I hated you, I wouldn’t tell you about Jesus!” (my opinion)”

      That’s all it would take! One wouldn’t even have to exact any other revenge on their worst enemy, as this would more than take care of it. That’s a very deep and profound thought! I believe that’s why Christ instructed us to pray for our enemies, to bless them, and to love them! Thanks!

  • MG

    Another false minister…failing the test….and no one was really asking questions….a man is caught up in his own words,…or the lack thereof. If Jesus spoke about hell, then we as Christians should also.

  • Marian

    I agree with those who say you wouldn’t want to be Osteen on Judgment Day.

    Rev. 22:19 And if any man shall take away the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    Osteen has taken away verses 10 and 15 of Revelation, so he is clearly one of the “any man” referenced in verse 19.

  • carson

    so it’s the power of positive thinking?
    Is there some potential danger in that?
    Yes, quite alot.
    what if perhaps I go along and fall into the snare of thinking-I’m doing better..?
    me, myself, I’m…good/doing better/ok, in myself, my strength…etc etc.
    what is philippians 3:9 to my ‘positive thinking about myself, me, my own ‘righteousness’?

    repent, that’s doing better, and faith causes this and it’s also a gift of God (2nd timothy 2, ephesians 2) and faith causes works, so faith and Christ’s righteousness by grace..vs..mine own righteousness and self effort and positive thoughts about mine own merit..whatevers.
    Stick to the word of God and follow it/apply it,…no modern day tv preacher hogwash needed.

    What is luke 24:47 and john 16:8 along with romans 10..if faith comes by hearing what are many hearing, a partial gospel? a motivational speaker? the power of positive self image? A partial gospel is a false gospel.
    Why isn’t the whole word of God good enough anymore that people run to motivational speakers? Because the parts on judgement are scary? But to those in Christ there is now no condemnation, so reading the judgements parts are healthy and correctional and good along with all the rest of all that is written. What is Romans 8:16? But if one isn’t in Christ then yeah it’s scary, but running to ear ticklers won’t solve the problem, only coming wholly to Christ to be born again will.
    Doesn’t God lift up via His Word?
    Yes He does!! :))
    What is joy and peace with God vs positive thinking for that matter…

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    • Engr. nelson

      Honestly, you guys are all wonderful. I took time to go through every comment on this tread and was surprised that as much as there were differing thoughts, nobody insulted anybody. Everyone expressed their opinion courteously, and buttressed their “facts” with scriptural quotations, at least within the context of their biblical knowledge. America is a civilized society indeed. I don’t mean to talk down on my country, but here in Nigeria, there couldn’t be such a debate, especially on social media, without the use of ill and abusive language. I’m so proud of you guys! But please you gotta realize that not everybody in Africa is illiterate and uncivilized, as you tend to assume. We’ve got very intelligent and smart minds here; only that our government has failed to create the enabling environment that we need (but we’re working toward creating it for ourselves). Having said that, my take is that the Bible is all encompassing. It covers all spheres of human endeavors, and as such, no part should of it should suffer. The gospel is a one stop package- Salvation, healing, deliverance, prosperity, happiness, etc are all we’re meant to enjoy as Christians. Some of these “benefits” come with principles, while a lot others require you to just be born again. There’s nothing wrong if anybody preaches prosperity or happiness. But there’s everything wrong if one does that at the detriment of the most crucial and vital message of salvation and repentance. Finally my brethren, “…for we know in parts.” Thanks, guys!

      • DC

        Welcome, Engr. Nelson, and what a nice post! Not all posts are courteous, I’m afraid; you got lucky to come across a good one. 🙂 Sometimes we get pretty fired up here. Geoffrey is pretty generous in letting people “vent.”
        Sometimes we like to dish out “tough love,” meaning we make stroooong suggestions or comments like we do with our children, “for their own good.”
        Most of the people have good hearts, which is why I come back often. We have to be patient with those who do insult with no reasoning behind it, though it’s not always easy to do.
        Thanks for sharing thoughts about your country. I hope we hear from you again. God bless you!

  • Karen

    Ya know, whether I agree or not with what is being said about Joel Osteen, and I can see all sides. . .is not my point. The point is that whatever Joel Osteen is or isn’t, the judgement, self-righteousness and down right contempt on this website is appalling.

    Presenting news is one thing, but targeting the same ministers and people and inciting disgraceful rhetoric over and over again under the guise of warning others about wolves in sheep’s clothing is getting quite old and boring. Frankly, it is unbecoming to Christians and God. Right or wrong, and we all are at different times, would you like people talking of you this way? We are ALL a work in progress. If you can’t say anything nice about someone, why don’t you be quiet and pray for God to give them wisdom to see the error of their ways? I wonder how Joel’s preaching might change if everyone that criticized him spent as much time praying for him. Wouldn’t you rather people did that for you instead of telling your flaws throughout your hometown?

    Pointing fingers and quoting scripture against others doesn’t make you a better Christian, it only draws attention to your own flaws.

  • John

    I gotta be honest, you guys scare the crap out of me. All of you.

    • DC

      Care to be specific? If you admit you’re a sinner, turn away from sin, and accept Jesus Christ as your personal Savior and His finished work on the Cross, you have nothing to be scared of. If you think that God is some kind of Santa Claus that gives us what we want if we but “plant a seed” or “name it and claim it” and think that your personal satisfaction is more important than Him, then you might want to rethink your theology.

      • John

        Well, that’s one reason. I make a super vague comment and without knowing anything about me, you take it upon yourself to simultaneously save my soul and insult what may or may not be my personal theology.

        • Howdy John, Well, it’s one or the other; either your soul needs to be saved, or of you are saved, then you don’t know enough scripture to discern truth from deception. If DC’s comment offended you, it’s probably because she struck a cord of truth that located you. Either way, you have work to do. BTW…your first response was honest, but I don’t think that people are purposefully vague to protect themselves since they actually open themselves up for inspection. I don’t see your last post as an honest statement. DC meant no harm (and neither do I). Rather than fume, ruminate on what she said and find out why your statement elicited a response such as hers. GOD be with you, BuffaloBilly

        • DC

          Then maybe try not to be so vague? I reached out to you thinking you were afraid of hell. Had you been more specific in criticizing that anyone dare to admonish Osteen, as we are told to admonish one another, I would have responded differently. BTW, I used the word ‘IF’ regarding theology, which could apply to anyone, but if you’re going to look really hard for offence, you’re sure to find it in this world.

          Hate to play teacher on you, but when writing one usually has a main idea, details, and a conclusion. It’s really not that hard.

    • Skywatcher

      John, I agree with DC, what do you have to fear? If you know God’s Word at all, Jesus told us 365 times, “Be not afraid, in one way or another.” One for everyday of the Gentile year! His message is one of love, forgiveness, acceptance, and protection. With Him in your boat, you have absolutely nothing to be afraid of.

      He’s not going to jump into your life without invitation though! He’s a perfect Gentleman, and He only comes into one’s life when invited, Rev. 3: 20,

      “Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.”

      John 1: 12, “But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.”

      Whether you have Him as your personal Savior and Lord is not going to make any difference in the outcome for the world, but it definitely will for you! He’s a wonderful Savior, and I wouldn’t trade Him in for anything in the world, nor for the world itself!

      What He has promised to those who love Him and obey His commandments cannot be measured by this world’s standards! Check it out:

      “But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.” I Cor. 2: 9.

      In modern English: If you know and love Christ as your own personal Savior and Lord, you cannot BEGIN TO IMAGINE or comprehend what God has prepared for YOU! This life is NOT all there is!

      That’s a tremendously exciting promise, John! It’s yours, free for the asking! Christ paid the price in full, so that you could inherit all things through Him!

      If you’d like to know more, talk to me; I’m here for ya, as are many others who have no fear of tomorrow!

    • Patrice

      We would,like to scare the hell out of you John.

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  • Karen

    I thought John meant because people are sounding so mean and judgemental lately on this site.

    • DC

      Which is his prerogative, but he would be better served if he just came out and said exactly what he found so offensive. At least that gives the opposition something to defend. Saying what he did gains us nothing—like one hand clapping.

      • Skywatcher

        DC, I can tell you what role you’re going to play in Heaven! You’re going to be an intergalactic stand-up comedienne! “like one hand clapping” ~ That’s too funny! Thanks for the laugh! God bless you!

        • DC

          You’re the funny one. I wasn’t trying to be funny, but I’m glad you got a charge out of it.
          No, I’m just tired of people making blanket statements that contribute nothing to discussion. People can be misled, as I was in thinking the person was afraid of hell. It’s fine to vent, but be specific in what you’re venting—or read up on effective argument, persuasive speaking, even inference. Make a point/main idea, back it up with examples/details, and end with a conclusion that gives your audience something to think about. (Can you tell I was and English teacher? My red pen’s around here somewhere….) Discourse allows for both sides to be able to share their views and make counterpoints on the other person’s views. You can’t do that when one side isn’t giving you anything with which to work, hence the one hand clapping.

          • Skywatcher

            Hi there, DC! I got your point from your original post. I felt the same way, but you got ahead of me. It’s rather pointless to come out and make a statement, leaving people to wonder what the writer was thinking about, or “where did that come from?!” question.

            The part that struck me funny was the “one had clapping”. It reminded me of a really good joke I had heard years ago. I cannot remember it now, but I can still see the picture in my mind.

            I’ll bet you can put that red pen of yours to good use when you read my posts! I greatly enjoy your posts! God is using you, and we get the benefit of your keen mind and sound teaching! Thank you! God bless!

  • Engr. nelson

    Honestly, you guys are all wonderful. I took time to go through every comment on this tread and was surprised that as much as there were differing thoughts, nobody insulted anybody. Everyone expressed their opinion courteously, and buttressed their “facts” with scriptural quotations, at least within the context of their biblical knowledge. America is a civilized society indeed. I don’t mean to talk down on my country, but here in Nigeria, there couldn’t be such a debate, especially on social media, without the use of ill and abusive language. I’m so proud of you guys! But please you gotta realize that not everybody in Africa is illiterate and uncivilized, as you tend to assume. We’ve got very intelligent and smart minds here; only that our government has failed to create the enabling environment that we need (but we’re working toward creating it for ourselves). Having said that, my take is that the Bible is all encompassing. It covers all spheres of human endeavors, and as such, no part should of it should suffer. The gospel is a one stop package- Salvation, healing, deliverance, prosperity, happiness, etc are all we’re meant to enjoy as Christians. Some of these “benefits” come with principles, while a lot others require you to just be born again. There’s nothing wrong if anybody preaches prosperity or happiness. But there’s everything wrong if one does that at the detriment of the most crucial and vital message of salvation and repentance. Finally my brethren, “…for we know in parts.” Thanks, guys!

  • Tusitala

    Thank You, Lord Jesus, for sending me a no-nonsense, hellfire and damnation, King James only preacher who told me what I needed to hear not what I wanted to hear.

  • Engr. Nelson

    I truly admire the likes (comments) of DC, BuffaloBilly and Skywatcher. You guys have the word of God embedded in you. I know that nobody is perfect and we all strive toward attaining perfection, but I think you guys can guide me into becoming a better Christian, because honestly speaking, I’m having atheistic tendencies. I tend to apply logic to virtually everything, including my Christian faith and it has proven abortive thus far. I even had to quit studying the Bible because nothing seems logical about it. I play the keyboard for my local assembly, and I’ve heard all manner of sermons. Nothing just seems to be making sense to me. I ask questions like “…If God truly is omnipotent, why can’t he just take away all the sufferings in the world?” Even I who am human feel so much pity seeing people dejected and suffering all over the world, and would instantly take away all the pain, if I could, let alone the ‘supposedly’ loving and caring God. Also, “…had I been born into an Islamic home or in an Arabic country, wouldn’t I most probably be a Muslim? How then would God judge those who were born into other religions, since they didn’t choose that for themselves? Would it suffice to say that they should have sought the truth? How much have I myself inquired into other religions to see whether they’re the ‘truth’?” I could go on and on and ask a lot other questions, to which I haven’t found convincing answers. “How would God judge those scientists who do not believe Him, since their ‘perception’ is what has most often than not inspired them
    to make research and discover more about the world we live in, thereby inventing things to better our lives? Why didn’t God just invent those things Himself? Why did he give us a sense of reasoning, since he doesn’t want us to apply logic in understanding Him? Even in the Christiandom itself, why are there so many factions? Which one is the truth?” As I type this, I’m almost crying, because I’m lost! These amongst many other questions have being met with no convincing answers. I don’t want to be antheist. I still believe in the existence of a “designer”, but why isn’t everything just logical? Please help me.

    • Howdy Nelson, First of all, thank-you for the compliment although there are many deserving contributors on this strand who are equally capable. So, I pray that I will be able to live up to your praise and expectations, First, let’s attack this concept of logic.
      Nelson, as Bible-believing Christians, we are in an odd arena. We believe in talking donkeys, stairways to heaven, seas that part to allow people to cross them, staffs that turn to snakes, virgin birth, resurrection of the dead, water that turns to wine, the sun standing still in the sky, voices from the sky, walking on water, water that issues from a rock…and the list can continue. Why do we believe these things? We believe because our GOD made these things to happen and we believe our GOD. None of it is logical and we don’t try to make sense of any of it because in a logical world these things just don’t happen. But in the realm of the supernatural where our GOD dwells, these things are common and spill over into our world of existence. Do we then just throw logic out the window? GOD forbid…we do use logic to interpret scripture as I will show you later in this letter. All Christians will say that they believe in GOD, but one becomes hard-pressed to find those that BELIEVE GOD. And there lies the crux of the matter. Satan will use logic and reasoning to draw people away from the Bible and CHRIST for the simple reason that–it just doesn’t make sense. Satan is doing that to you and you need to resist and acknowledge that GOD doesn’t always or have to make sense to us. HE is GOD after all, right?? Don’t stop reading your Bible, but pray for the HOLY SPIRIT to reveal truths to you as you read and to help you find your answers. I always pray before I read my Bible…it’s an excellent practice and GOD DOES answer those prayers!
      When GOD created mankind, HE gave us a great gift called free will–the ability to choose for ourselves–that same freedom that our governments are slowly stealing from us. GOD will not intervene in our decisions because that would violate free will. HE allows the evils in this world to continue because HE is giving humanity time to reconcile themselves to him. If you look at John 3:16, “For GOD so loved the world (HIS creation-humanity), that HE gave HIS only begotten SON; that whosoever should believe in HIM should not perish but have everlasting life”. GOD sacrificed HIS OWN SON that we might be reconciled back to HIM through the atoning blood of HIS SON. What religion on earth has its god doing this? Muslims? Hare Krishnas? Buddhists? Mormons? Hindus? You name it–NONE of them. The evil in this world is caused by satan and his minions and they are taking advantage of the time that GOD gives humanity for salvation…to destroy humanity through violence. Recall, “The thief (satan) cometh not but to kill, steal, and destroy”. GOD is not the author of all this mayhem on the planet, but HE must allow it in order for HIS plan of redemption to continue. People always want to blame GOD…but the truth is that satan is the author of all this destruction, evil, disease, and sadness. As Christians, we are aware of this; but an unbelieving world will never see the truth of the matter. Look at Proverbs 16:4 for some insight.
      GOD sends out missionaries all over the world and these people preach HIS gospel. In today’s modern era of electronics, HIS message is transmitted by TV, radio, satellite so that all will hear HIS message of hope. Therefore, all those who are born into other religions will have a chance to hear GOD’S WORD and at an age of accountability, be able to make a conscious decision for CHRIST or not. Many will not heed GOD’S message and will face the final countdown of the 7 year tribulation foretold in Daniel and Revelation. There will be a price to pay. Of course, the way to escape this dire 7 year time is to accept CHRIST as LORD and SAVIOR. That is what a Christian should be doing now–to show people how to be saved and escape this terrible future. GOD will see to it that all people will have heard HIS message of salvation; otherwise, how can HE judge them?? This applies to all those wonderful scientists too. GOD will draw these people to HIM (John 6:44, 2 Peter 3:9). Remember, if people CHOOSE not to believe GOD, then they are judged already–no matter what they have done for mankind.
      Why doesn’t GOD just invent our “conveniences” himself? GOD works through man…so does satan. All these great inventions were once ideas in someone’s head, right? Well, GOD and satan both have access to our thoughts and our minds are a battleground between good and evil. Man’s free will decides what he will do with these ideas–how they will be used. And HE gave us a sense of logic or reasoning (the Bible calls that discernment) so that we may be able to figure out truth from lies–IF WE STUDY HIS WORD!!! If we do not study GOD’S WORD, how are we to know truth? Satan’s lies then become truth, right? See how logic can work with the scriptures?
      There are many factions (sects) in Christianity because satan has gotten into the body of CHRIST and created the divisions…again by encroaching on their minds. Satan divides…GOD unites. They are always arguing over denominational doctrine and who is right and how is this scripture interpreted. Most of this bickering is never a salvation issue, but people just always seem to have to be right. I like to be right and strive to be, but I know that won’t happen because “we know in part, and we prophesy in part…for now we see through a glass darkly…” (1 Cor 13:9, 12). We will never know the whole story until “that which is perfect is come” (1 Cor 13:10) and I believe that it is the New Jerusalem at the end of the millenial reign of CHRIST “For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as I am known.” (1 COR 13:12). “But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the LORD, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the SPIRIT of the LORD” ( 2 COR 3:18). The New Jerusalem is the last prophecy to be fulfilled and it is then that GOD the FATHER comes down to dwell with man and we shall see HIM “face to face”.
      Nelson, I have tried my best at this time. Always remember these truths: All that happens in this world is the result of a spiritual battle between GOD and satan and that battle spills over into our realm (Ephesians 6:12). The battleground is also in your mind. Satan will put endless questions in your mind to confuse you. GOD will answer those questions if you but seek and wait. You choose what you do with the thoughts that your mind generates. You can choose good or evil…BUT the choice is yours. If you stay away from GOD’S WORD, then you open yourself up to lies and deception because you will not be able to discern truth from lies. GOD’S WORD will keep you from sin…sin will keep you from GOD’S WORD. If you ever have those feelings of doubt, read the Book of Psalms and the Book of Proverbs. They are a great blessing. Also, Read Matthew 10:28 carefully and take it to heart…your eternity rests there.
      Love in CHRIST, BuffaloBilly

      • Skywatcher

        Good afternoon, Bro. BBB and all! Bro, that was excellent counsel! I praise the Lord for brethren who really know their Bible!

        4 a.m.! I was just getting out of bed when you wrote that post! It is almost 1 p.m. here now, and I’m really feeling it! 🙁 Not as young as I was 50 years ago! “Nelson” is going to be o.k. Living and walking by faith is so easy for some, and for others, not so much.

        I see the JW is back and playing Satan’s hand by attempting to sow the seeds of doubt: “The KJV has countless changed, added, removed words. It is not filled with truth.”

        I was thinking about him this morning as I was on my 100 mile journey. For the Watch Tower pimps to be telling Christians what is the truth is a tragic comedy of sorts. Christianity has been around for thousands of years and we follow the ancient Scriptures, while they follow after a “cunningly devised fable” of the late 1800’s! And to boot, it’s be revised and “updated” several times! That makes them the newbie on the religious front. They’re like a 5 year old child telling the mother the facts of life, and that Mama’s idea of it is all wrong! How incredibly stupid is that!

        Thanks, for your excellent post! ONE MORE SLEEP and then fishing season opens!!! YAAAAYYYYYY!!! God bless you, Bro.!

        • Emery

          As per your usual post, you PROVE beyond any doubt that you are definately NOT Christian, but are of Christendom.

          You claim that Billy “really knows” his Bible, but the Bible he knows is not accurate. So it’s of no use to him or anyone else. The KJV is a false translation, but since you are too lazy to research the question, you won’t ever know that, will you. And calling me “the JW” is disparaging God’s people, and thereby disparaging God Himself. No witness for God EVER plays “Satan’s hand” either, it is you who is doing that in your posts by disparaging God and His witnesses on Earth. I sow no “seeds of doubt”, I sow seeds of the Kingdom and of truth, things you reject wholeheartedly for some suicidal reason or another. The magazine THE WATCHTOWER is incapable of pimping anything, it’s A MAGAZINE. And nothing is comical about teaching the goats like you the truth of God’s inspired word that is not found in the KJV. The things we follow are the inspired word of God, and it was not inspired in the 1800’s. The IBSA was though. It’s a SOCIETY of holy spirit annointed persons, those who have received the INVITATION from God to be a part of the 144,000 co-kings with Jesus in heaven, but you know nothing about that since you cling to false translations and false religion. God’s inspired word says ALL religions are false and works of the flesh. That must be why you cling to them so tightly. And God’s Earthly witnesses are by no means “newbies”. The command to witness for God is in Isaiah, and several times after that book was penned, but you know nothing about that either, since God’s word is anathema to you. And teaching the truth of God’s word is definately not stupid, but those who claim it is are. Like you. Stop serving your master, Satan, and return to God.

          • Skywatcher

            Emery, I didn’t even waste my time reading your lies and deceptions in this post! You’re in dire need of the Savior, and deliverance from your pimp!

        • Howdy Skywatcher, Would you believe I started that post at @ 2:30 am my time (Florida)? I am back to spending too much time on this site, but I think that THE LORD puts me on here so who am I to argue. We have to respond to cries for help…sorta like GOD’S personal EMT’s huh? Well, yes, Emery is back with more gobbledegook. It is nice that he is sold out for JW’s. Imagine what he could do for the one, true, living GOD… It seems that there is always one of these unusual characters on every strand that we visit..and they all eventually disappear since their “doctrine of demon’s” won’t take root. Maybe THE LORD is providing us with some entertainment of sorts… GOD Bless you my Brother and as always…thank-you for your kindness, praise, and encouragement. In CHRIST, BuffaloBilly

          • Skywatcher

            Yes, Brother BB, for us to stay up late to serve our Lord and to help others is a mighty small price to pay! I’m just starting to read my posts again now; been outside for a couple of hours, enjoying the day that the Lord has made!

            I feel so bad for Emery! He’s probably a really great guy, but oh, as you say, what he could do if he were on the side of the Light of the World, Yeshua/Jehovah! He is to be admired for his determination, but the deception takes away from the true message of the gospel. Imagine the peace and real joy he could have if Christ were his Savior and Lord! Jesus Christ makes all the difference!

            He’s a poor source of entertainment, and I won’t entertain him with anymore responses. However, I will expose him and his lies every chance I get! Father’s heart desires that mankind be saved from the Lake of Fire, not enticed into it with false doctrine. When the kid tells the mother she is wrong, it needs a slap up side the head and be put in its place.

            Well, Bro, I must read some more posts. A fellow twig in the True Vine!

    • DC

      Engr. Nelson, I read your comment very early this morning and didn’t have time to answer you until now. Please know that I thought of you much today and prayed for you.

      You say you deal in logic. I assume you are an engineer by your title, so that makes sense. What God did for us defies logic. Buffalo Billy gave a lot of good examples of things that don’t make sense logically, but we take them in and believe them on faith. I have two adult sons (one an electrical engineer and one a mechanical engineer; how cool is that? Now I’m talking to you. God does stuff like that on purpose!) I could never sacrifice their lives for other people—that’s not logical. A mother (or father) would rather die than have her child die. (Abraham didn’t want to but was willing to do it with Isaac, but God spoke directly to him, so maybe he knew things would turn out ok. He had a lot of faith!) God considers us all His children and He sacrificed the One for the rest of us, so that those who believe could be with Him forever, like He wanted it in the first place with Adam and Eve. No other god would do that! People have to die for the god, not the other way around. So it’s not about logic; it’s all about faith. Believe you are so loved that the God Who created the Universe would let His own Son, a virtual part of Himself, die for you.

      Your other friends here already answered why God allows so much suffering–God never wanted sickness, disease, or suffering, but He let Adam and Eve decide if they wanted to obey Him or their own free will. He will not force anyone to obey Him; it is our choice. Well, sin entered the world and all the evil with it. (In Greek mythology it was explained by opening Pandora’s Box. All this evil came out and couldn’t be put back in.) Since the “perfect world” was lost, and God gives us free will, and all these temptations are out there we’ve had to struggle ever since. Yes, He could cure all the sick and eradicate disease and save people from being hurt (by other people using THEIR free will), but His ways aren’t our ways. He wants people to love each other and do His work out of their love for Him. That’s why people become doctors, nurses, missionaries, scientists looking for cures, police officers, soldiers fighting wars to free the persecuted, and so on.

      What if your friend gets cancer and everyone is praying? What if his own father never prays, but seeing his child suffer makes him finally reach out to God? God uses something bad to get something good. Isn’t the father’s eternal life more important than the child’s temporary one here on earth, which the bible says is just a vapor compared to eternity? Sometimes when people die, their loved ones turn AWAY from God, so we now need other people to pray they come back to Him and tell them it’s Satan who creates the evil; God just allows it to happen and somehow He will work it out for good. I hate abortion but I know those little ones are in Heaven with our Lord!

      I’ve asked the question before about other religions. If Muslims are forced to practice Islam or die, especially if they are caught with a bible, does God understand that and save them? What about people in remote areas that have never heard the gospel? The answer I got wasn’t very comforting, so maybe someone else can give us both a better answer. Yes, He sends missionaries to help do His work, but what if they aren’t allowed in a country? Also, I agree that even in Christianity we have different denominations and doctrine on things. What is essential is that you believe you are a sinner in need of a Savior or you’re going to hell, you turn away from your sin, and ask Jesus to be your Lord and Savior. Accept what He did on faith. His Holy Spirit will guide you; in fact, if you feel bad when you sin or doubt, that’s the Holy Spirit working in you, convicting you that it’s wrong and prompting you to confess it. If you were really an atheist, you wouldn’t care like you do.

      I don’t know your bible experience, but if you need to read the gospel again, start with John. He is writing to a general audience in the simplest language. Also read the Psalms. We can all relate to the suffering and anguish there, but note how the psalmist relies on God to deliver him. I listen to a Christian radio station a lot, and when I really need it, it seems like the perfect song comes on! Also check out youtube where there are lots of Christian songs, many with the words right there as it’s playing. If you need suggestions, ask. Start with Casting Crowns “Who Am I?” I will put link at the end.

      Know that even Mother Theresa, in working with unbearable situations of poverty, disease, and paganism doubted some times, and I know God is merciful when we have doubts and questions. Much love to you, brother. Let us know how you are doing. God bless you! Your friend and sister in Christ, Denise (DC)

      This video doesn’t have the lyrics, but you can search and find them easily. This with movie clips from the “Gospel of John” movie (with actor that was in the tv series Lost) makes me cry when I think of what Jesus did for me. “Not because of who I am but because of what YOU’VE done; Not because of what I’ve done but because of WHO YOU ARE” Get’s me every time.

    • Skywatcher

      Good day, Engr. Nelson (and all)!

      I trust that you are doing better now, Nelson, with the information that has been given you. I’d like to take a moment to talk about this strange stuff called “faith”.

      What is faith? Being involved in your assembly Nelson, hopefully you’ve probably heard this a dozen times,

      “Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.” Heb. 11: 1

      That’s a really twisted way of saying, faith is **believing or trusting for, or in **Someone or something that we haven’t seen yet.

      “Faith is a living, daring confidence in God’s grace, so sure and certain that a man could stake his life on it a thousand times.” Martin Luther

      “Faith sees the invisible, believes the unbelievable, and receives the impossible.” Corrie ten Boom

      “The beginning of anxiety is the end of faith and the beginning of true faith is the end of anxiety.” George Muller

      Where does it come from?

      “For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, ACCORDING AS GOD HATH DEALT to every man the measure of faith. Rom. 12: 3

      We get our measure of faith from God! Each person is given a portion, some more and some less, as it would appear, and it needs nurturing! Our churches are seriously lacking these days, when they no longer have testimony times! As a teen, it was those testimonies of what God had done or was doing in the lives of the saints that greatly increased my faith and trust in God! I drew strength and encouragement from them! Since God could do it for them, there was hope for me!

      Why is faith necessary or important?

      “But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. Heb. 11: 6

      Only a fool would pray to somebody they don’t really believe exists. Before they started, they’d know they were wasting their time.

      “But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. 7. For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord. 8. A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.” James 1: 6-8

      Faith and trust are the best of buddies; they work together. There is no point in having faith if it is not coupled with trust. You cannot have trust in anything or anyone without faith present.

      We can say that we have faith in God, but do we really? Do we really trust Him? Do we really believe He hears our prayers? Do we really believe He can answer our prayers?

      What are the results of faith? Read the rest of Hebrews 11, and you’ll see what big things faith can accomplish! All those people found that their faith in God was perfectly founded and rewarded. God NEVER let a single one of them down! Does He love you any less? Of course not! Can He use your little mustard seed of faith to accomplish much for His honor and His glory? You bet! Are you brave enough to allow Him to?

      O.k. Now we know what faith is, where it comes from, who possesses it, and what it can do. Let’s see how it equates to our daily living…

      When we go to sit down on a chair, it takes faith to believe it will hold us up. When we go to start our vehicle, it takes faith to believe that all the hidden parts will work together to achieve our desired goal. When a woman is told she is pregnant, it takes faith to believe something for which she has no visual proof for, and more so for the daddy, who has no morning sickness! Faith is sitting on board a plane or a ship believing those at the helm are trained and competent to get us safely to our destination. We require faith to believe the thing will remain afloat or airborne! Faith that the floor won’t open up under our seat and dump us out! Faith that no hijackers will appear. Faith that no bomb hasn’t been planted on board. Faith that the harbor pilot or flight controllers are awake at their posts, and are well trained in their respective fields! Faith is believing the boat or plane will not only start, but get us to our destination.

      Lately, I’ve been challenging people to show me a calorie! YES I HAVE! A can of Sprite soda pop tells me it has 140 calories in it. How do they know there aren’t 138 calories? 100 calories? 2 calories? Has anybody ever seen a calorie? We believe it because we have faith and trust in the producer, to know what they are talking about. But do they really? Why should I believe this? What tangible proofs can they show me of a calorie? Can they place two side-by-side on a plate and show them to me? Of course not! But we believe! Wise or not? You be the judge.

      We cannot see electricity as it courses through the wires, but we know it works, and how we can use it to our advantage, etc. We have faith it will be there when we go to flip on a switch. We have faith that same switch will turn it off when necessary. We have faith that we will get water when we turn on the tap, and that it will stop when we turn the tap off. We have faith that we will wake up in the morning, after all…we’ve been doing it all our lives! The past is a good indicator of things to come. We have faith in gravity…

      I want to use a good example that everybody can relate to, that may remind us of faith when it happens. I don’t mean to be rude or crude, but let’s face it, everybody breaks wind one time or another. Can you see it? NO, but a whole room will clear out because their faith (that you only broke wind) and logic tells them something familiar, yet unseen and unpleasant has just occurred! If still able to do so, the dog will give you a dirty look, get up, and stagger out of the room before it gets the blame! It too has a measure of faith! Your buddies don’t wait around for a confession; they clear out ASAP! Why is that?

      They react from personal experience and have faith that this occurrence will have the same predictable ending! In good faith, they know nothing good is going to come out of that action! Before it happens, one can occasionally hear rumblings in the tummy. They expect something is going to happen, and they have faith that it will eventually pass, and they’re ready to run! It may be pleasant, relieving the pressure and discomforts of gas. Or, it may be very unpleasant…relieving one temporarily of their friends, and causing the dog to go cross-eyed before passing out. Another act of faith believes that your friends will eventually come back and your dog will still love you! That’s real faith!

      On the other hand, when a good thing occurs, i.e., a couple just got wind that a baby is on the way. With faith and logic, they can expect a baby in nine months or so. They and others will spend those long and laborious months waiting for someone they’ve never seen! That’s faith! Do we know how all the little nerve endings, cells, organs, etc. are formed in the cavern of darkness? Nope! Do we need to know? Nope! Faith believes/trusts God will put all these bits and pieces together in all the right places! Going to work and believing you’re coming home at the end of the day requires faith. When we have seen results of our faith, in answers to prayer, it gives us encouragement and hope that God will do it again or something even greater in our future, or for others.

      These simple analogies are plenty of common evidence for Heb. 11: 1, which I’ve cited at the top. Now…let us get to the real clincher, where the rubber meets the road in our faith walk! We have seen how faith works for us each day, in a few common examples. Let’s raise this up a notch or two!

      Wind, we can feel, see or hear the effects of it, but we can’t see it. We can see its path of destruction or we can see it push a beautiful little sailboat across the lake on a nice sunny day. We can see it smash down big tall trees, or we can watch it carry an eagle for hours upon its lofty currents. Faith is no different; it defies our senses and logic, but we can and do benefit from it.

      I will have to do this in two parts, I believe…

      • Skywatcher

        Part two for Engr. Nelso and all:

        Years ago, I heard older folks state from time to time, “Love makes the world go ’round.”

        I have no issues with that, but what is love? Where does it come from? LOVE…can you see it? Taste it? Touch it? Hear it? Smell it? Of course not! Can one have faith without love? Atheists hate this one! I ask them, “Have you ever been loved or have you ever loved somebody?” Of course their answer is “Yes.” I reply, “Well then, you have confessed that you have experienced God!” GOD IS LOVE! I John 4: 8, 16. The jaws drop.

        How can this be? God doesn’t fit into our physical senses; He transcends them! Oh yes, we can feel love when we’re giving or receiving it and we can feel lovable, but without God, none of that would be possible! God is the spark that kindles the fires of love within us! It didn’t result from a big bang out in the cosmos somewhere! It has to have a Source. God was and is eternal and the starting point of love in our lives originated with Him.

        Without faith in GOD (LOVE), it is impossible to please Him! Heb. 11: 6 Why? LOVE demands faith and faith requires love! Love requires an object to invest itself into (creation); faith requires an object to be directed to (Creator). Love demands man’s faith be directed to Him. Faith willingly desires to believe in Him (or something) and to act accordingly. How can you please someone you have no faith or trust in, or why would you want to? Faith requires LOVE, for without LOVE, faith could not exist!

        Because God has shown us love and given us the capacity to love, it breaks our hearts to see others suffer in ways we believe are needless. It breaks our heart to see His beautiful creation being destroyed. As DC and BuffaloBilly have stated, God allows things to happen in our lives to mold us and to shape us; to draw us closer to Himself, and to shape character within us. It’s what we do with those situations that determines how much good can come out of them. God allows bad things to happen to others so that we who have His love, can step up to the plate, and show His love to them in tangible ways, ways that Scriptures on their own sometimes will not do. We can allow people or bad experiences to drive us closer to God or further away from Him. Either way, His love toward us will not change, Romans 5: 8. WE and WE ALONE, determine our ultimate destiny. God CANNOT and WILL NOT decide that for us! That’s the free choice that He affords us, using faith as the key to unlock Heaven’s door.

        Why is so much faith required to believe in God? Simple! WE CANNOT SEE HIM! Ironically, people find it so easy to believe an imaginary calorie count in which they cannot see the principle players, and yet, find it so hard to believe in the God who created the universe and everything in it…including the ever-looming calorie! Why is it so hard to believe in God who loves them dearly and wants them to be blessed beyond imagination through a close relationship with Him? Why is it so hard to believe that this infinite God of love has a plan and a purpose for us now (Jn. 10: 10), and desires to see us safely home with Him for all eternity?

        Why do folk “run away from” or avoid at all cost little itty-bitty calories, for fear these invisible things will jump all over them, clinging to them to make them fat? Why is it so hard to view the mighty mountains, the colorful birds and butterflies that flit around us, stopping to consider how their little bodies work to accomplish the purpose for which God has designed them, and then not have faith in their Creator, OUR CREATOR? People are ridiculously silly!

        God’s Word is overflowing with an abundance of historic, scientific, geographic, geologic and archaeologic proofs for His existence, and yet many choose to turn away from Him. They literally have to turn their backs on Him, despite knowing the truth!

        Why is that? I believe that question demands an answer or two. Some refuse to believe the evidence of His existence, foolishly hoping the Day of Judgment will also go away. WRONG! Some foolishly believe that if they choose to believe He doesn’t really exist, then they can live a life of sin and debauchery, without fear of repercussion or reprisal. WRONG! They then deceive themselves that they have nobody to be responsible or accountable to. WRONG! Some (backslidden Christians and others) are deceived into believing they “are too far gone” in sin, to be forgiven. WRONG! Many refuse to believe because, “The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.” They have been deceived or have chosen to totally mentally and spiritually divorce themselves from the issue altogether. They have willingly and knowingly stifled or killed the little seed of faith that was originally implanted into their hearts upon conception. In effect, they have said, “God, I don’t need you!”

        I believe we’re all adults here, and if not, you’ve heard worse or seen worse at school or on your Hellevision. Stand naked in front of a full-length mirror sometime, Nelson and all, and take a good look at yourself. Now, I’m not intending to be crude, lewd, or suggestive by this, other than to suggest we stop, and consider how absolutely wonderfully and fearfully (reverentially) made you are! Try to overlook your artistic touches to His perfect work…wrinkles, rolls, scars, etc.! We are born with numerous organs that don’t require our faith to make them work, but we have faith in our Creator to provide for and to sustain our bodies, so that they will work correctly. If we don’t now, we will want faith to believe He will fix them when they eventually get broken or forget to work!

        I am thoroughly amazed at how anybody can possibly believe that our bodies formed over thousands of years between the development of each successive cell, without an Intelligent Designer (God), who spoke them all simultaneously into place. This is NOT logical, and it takes tremendous amounts of faith to believe a single-celled amoeba got to live long enough for that next precise, correct, complicated, and vitally essential cell to form “thousands of years later”, before the first one(s) died from starvation or just dried up! It takes faith to believe they have reached the point of perfection that they are at today, and have been from the beginning of time! It requires more faith to believe Evolution than it does to believe in Almighty God! It takes a FOOL to say there is no God! Psa. 53: 1 By the way, today is the only religious holiday out of the whole year for atheists. Thank God for God or they couldn’t celebrate! Happy April Fool’s Day! ENJOY!

        Take a look in the mirror again…look at those beautiful eyes (forget the suitcases that might be under them), but look at those two precious little servants that are there for you… every day of your life! There are literally MILLIONS of microscopic and nanoscopic nerves and nerve endings that work in those two little bags of jelly! They work tirelessly for us (most times), without complaint or failure. When we go to bed at night, our faith and logic tells us, those two butlers should be right there at our beck and call when we crack open their hairy shutters first thing in the morning. For most people they are! We have a measure of faith to believe they will navigate us throughout the day, getting us here and there safely and soundly. We have faith that they will reward us with sights and pleasures for another day; for most, they will. So you see, we use faith without even realizing it. It is not only important and beneficial in the physical world, Nelson and all, it is vitally important in the spiritual realm also.

        Don’t forget…we are eternal spiritual beings, housed in temporary bodies of flesh, having a brief human experience. Christ has proven that to us! Praise His holy name!

        No matter how much one tries to convince oneself, and it takes much convincing, to believe there is no God, they cannot honestly do it! Those without Him can NEVER EVER explain how matter, life, or emotions came about or where they came from, apart from an Intelligent Designer that intelligent people have been calling “God Almighty” for thousands of years! Equally, there is no possible way folk can ever deny the reality, the presence or the peace of God when they possess Him! The more we immerse ourselves in God’s Word, and spend time with Him in prayer and fellowship, the more He reveals Himself to us. When you hear Him speak softly and sweetly in your spirit via your conscience, you will never forget it, and you’ll want to hear Him more!

        When He gently speaks words of correction, we get to recognize His voice even more. If you’re not hearing His voice, try to do something wrong! You’ll hear Him right away! After you do something wrong, it impedes the connection between you and God, causing doubt to creep in over time. If you confess that wrong right away, you’ll be reconnected right away!

        Nelson, are you familiar with that beautiful song, “In Christ Alone”? This is a fantastic song of faith, and I would suggest you learn it and sing it as your motto song for awhile. You probably already know it but let the words sink way down deep in your heart, as they are as true as true can be! One of the beauties of this song is that it is historically accurate, and whether the world knows it or not, it stands upon historical markers, in reference to Christ’s earthly existence: “B.C.” and “A.D.”, as our calendars used to be marked. This is further evidence that the Antichrist is alive and well behind the scenes, awaiting his appearance; he changed the times and seasons, Dan. 2: 21. Now, “BC” = “BCE”, and AD = “CE” to please the Muslims.

        I hope this has helped you, Nelson, or somebody else in your faith walk today! Looking forward to hearing back from you, Nelson. Please don’t make us feel as though we’re talking to ourselves! We value your input, and anybody else whom this has touched, I’d love to hear from you, and assist you also! God bless you! 🙂

        • DC

          Great lesson, Sky. Only you could incorporate calories and breaking wind into sharing the gospel! BTW, when you break that wind in Nova Scotia, we know it all the way down here. We call it a Nor’Easter!

          • Skywatcher

            Thanks, DC! You are so funny! I think we had a Nor’Easter here last evening! March went out like a lion…extremely powerful winds. God bless!

  • Emery

    The inspired word of God does not contain a “hell” doctrine. Take this example: Doctrinal bias can easily color a translator’s work. For example, Matthew 7:13 says: “Spacious is the road leading off into destruction.” Some translators, perhaps affected by doctrinal bias, have used the term “hell” rather than what the Greek term really means, namely, “destruction.”

    God’s word doesn’t use the word hell. Many translations use it, incorrectly. In the vernacular (the common language of the period) hell meant, in a very limited Greek usage, the “common grave of mankind”. NEVER was it ever used to describe some place of fire and torment. God’s word teaches that we ARE A LIVING SOUL, not that we HAVE a soul. His word says that “nothing survives death”, and that the “soul that sinneth, it itself SHALL DIE”. If a soul is immortal, why does God’s word say it dies? Soul and life are synonyms, not two separate parts of us. So you can fault Osteen for a LOT of things, this isn’t one of them. He doesn’t seem to know the scriptures at all, and is part of false religion. God’s word says ALL religions are false religion, works of the flesh, and Babylon the Great’s largest part. The ORIGINAL “one true faith” that Jesus taught is the ONLY Christianity that exists. Christendom’s sects/denominations are nothing more than counterfeit COPIES of what Jesus taught, and very poor copies at best. The original still is practiced today, so why anyone would cling to a copy of it, and experience God’s wrath as a result, makes NO sense whatsoever.

    • Skywatcher

      Emery, I don’t know if I am, but I want to be the first to tell you to take your corrupt Jehovah’s Witness New World Translation doctrine out of here! Your teachings are no better than Joel Osteen’s heresies. You do this all the time; I’d think by now, you’d be getting tired of getting beaten up for promoting lies. You can jump on me all you want! That won’t change a thing!

      • Emery

        It’s a terrible shame you are so opposed to God and His servants. You are supposed to be a servant of God, but disparage His servants, His word, and His teachings. There is NOTHING corrupt about the NWT at all, in fact it is 100% accurate compared to all 5,000 original existing texts. Your KJV has over 19,000 mistranslated words, added spurious texts, and has completely eliminated the name of God from it’s pages. I have never promoted even one lie, and It’s not possible to get “beaten up” on a blog. And I know you won’t ever change, because you cling to the inspired translations and religions of Satan like a liferaft in the middle of the ocean during a storm. You are so misled, you think everything you have ever been spoon fed by those false religions is actually the truth, when none of it really is. You don’t behave like a Christian, you don’t think like one, and you don’t do anything a Christian is required by God to do. In fact, you strive very hard to do the opposite of the will of God. Remember that the love of God means that you do His ENTIRE will, and His will is not burdensome. But to you, it’s impossible.

    • Howdy Emery, Your bible and your god don’t have the doctrine of hell because the enemy of your soul wants to surprise you in the end. It won’t be pretty… Maybe you should try JESUS, the SON of the True Living GOD; your future will become pretty and then some. Just a thought…BuffaloBilly PS Try GOD’S WORD…the King James Version of the BIBLE. It is filled with truth–no lie!!! (get it?) Get it!!!!

      • Emery

        There exist ONE GOD, AND one INSPIRED WORD He left for us. It’s the TRANSLATIONS that are the problem, and the KJV has 19,000 deliberate mistranslated words, is missing the PERSONAL NAME of God 7,000 times, and has MANY added SPURIOUS TEXTS. The KJV is the LAST Bible I would ever use Billy. It’s a complete bastardization of God’s word. in the end of Revelation, God’s word says that to add or remove or changE ONE WORD of His inspired word, MAKES YOU GOD’S ENEMY. The KJV has countless changed, added, removed words. It is not filled with truth. It sits on my shelf simply for reference, as do the dozens of other translations that are like it. For 45 years I have researched and re-translated vast portions of the original scrolls, and there are 5,000 of them, and I know what God’s word says. The KJV is NOT God’s word.

        • Howdy Emery, I will have to respectfully disagree with you. The KJV lines up with the Dead Sea Scrolls and you can’t get any more accurate than that. I have had repeated prayers answered when “searching” the scriptures of the KJV and how could GOD answer those prayers if it were as you say. If any thing, all these modern versions starting with the NIV and adding are the true “bastardizations” of GOD’S WORD because of the changes that they have made. I have a great walk with my LORD and I am sure that HE would steer me to the right Bible if I was not in the correct one. This has not happened and if anything, HIS answers to prayer are all the confirmation that I need. GOD will not answer the prayers of HIS enemies so I cannot be the enemy of GOD…you can take that to the bank. Thanks for your civil reply, BuffaloBilly

          • Emery

            Your statement is completely incorrect. The KJV does NOT “line up” with the dead sea scrolls, or any of the other 5,000 that exist today. As I said, the KJV has 19,000 deliberate mistranslated words and omissions and spurious additions in it. The Dead Sea scrolls do not have any of those errors, they line up with all the other existing ones. Are you attempting to say that you’ve done the research and re-translating of those scrolls into English, and then compared them to the KJV? I assure you, it’s unlikely you have done so. God’s personal name is missing from the KJV 7,000 times, when it appears in the Dead Sea scrolls and all the others. It uses hell where the Koine word for hades and Gehenna originally appear. It uses church where ecclesia appears, which only translates into English as people and/or congregation, and NOT church. It uses cross where stake (stauros) originally appears. Your postulation being accurate is impossible based on these facts. If you want a closer to original translation, try Young’s Literal translation. It has errors, but very few. I’ve done this research probably longer than you’ve been alive, and done this translating as long as well. I’ve compared every scripture to every other scripture to attain it’s actual meaning. I’ve studied alongside members of the annointed 144,000 as well, and what you’ve posted does not bear any accuracy with regards to over 45 years of diligent research, and that of others as well. Granted, the annointed remnant alive right now, all 15,000 of them would also disagree with what you’ve posted. I know some of them personally, and God does not invite those who are not honest hearted, to be His adopted sons and daughters, as members of that 144,000 co-heirs with Jesus, God’s only begotten son.

  • Skywatcher

    Dear Engr. Nelson,

    “Welcome aboard, from Nova Scotia, Canada!”

    What a thrill and a delight to talk with somebody in Nigeria! DC has done a wonderful job welcoming you, and sharing a little bit about us, so I’ll move along.

    You play keyboard for your local assembly and I also used to play keyboard for numerous assemblies at one time. I see you’re having a difficult time with your faith walk at present. You have some mighty serious questions and they demand some mighty serous answers. We’ll get there!

    I am getting a little weary at this late hour, but Engr. Nelson, there is NO WAY I could go to bed after hearing your plea for help. We’ll walk through this thing together!

    I’m going to start at the root and we’ll move along together from there, o.k.? Are you born again? Have you at any time ever asked Jesus Christ to be your Savior and Lord? Once I know that, then I will know what direction to follow, so that I can help you better.

    Is “Nelson” your first name or last name? I just don’t want to have to type out “Engr. Nelson” each and every time I want to personally address you. Something a little shorter like “Nelson” would be great.

    If you are saved, then I can understand what is happening to you. You’ve reached a crossroads in your life that we all come to at one time or another. That’s normal! Satan will try his best to take back a soul from Christ that he thought he had! If you’re not saved, then I’ll also know which direction to go.

    In the meantime, you lay aside all the weights that so easily try to trip you up, and you look into the night sky, and say, “Lord, I believe, help my unbelief”. You won’t be the first one to pray this prayer. It was the demoniac’s father who cried this out,

    23. “Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth. 24. And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said **with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.”** Mark 9: 23, 24.

    This poor distraught father was so burdened for his son, that the tears were falling down his face as he looked into the face of the Lord of Glory, his Creator!

    This father was grieving because his son was being abused and ravaged by this deaf and dumb spirit. It was trying to destroy him, and the father and probably his mother were the ones who had to suffer the agonies of seeing their child be abused like that.

    I’m not saying you’re demon possessed, but what I am saying is that your Heavenly Father is very sad to see His son(? you) languish and suffer in the manner in which you are. He wants to see you delivered and made whole again, living an abundant life with peace, joy, happiness, hope and an earnest expectation of going home to be with HIM soon!

    Sometimes, my dear brother, we just cannot understand all things, and we have to let the tears flow…tears of frustration, tears of bewilderment, tears of anxiety…tears of hurt… and finally…tears of joy when the breakthrough finally happens! It will happen! I’m going to be praying for you EVERY DAY until it happens! Are you with me?

    I’m going to close for now, but you be on the lookout tomorrow! I’ll be rattling your cage, and you had better come out prepared to do battle with the devil and standing on his neck with a high hand of victory! God’s not through with you yet! He’s got something big in store for YOU! EVERY TIME I have those same feelings as you’re having (doubts and fears), God ends up putting me on a mission for Jesus, and oh the joy that floods my soul when He does that! It makes it all worth the struggle to that point!

    In those times, I’ve come to realize that Satan is trying to trip me up, because he doesn’t want me to experience yet another level of God’s mercy, grace, and purpose for my life! He doesn’t want God to use me to take another soul away from him!

    There is a spiritual battle in heavenly places for your soul right now! That’s abundantly obvious, but it’s not over yet! You have yourself a really great night, and our Saviour will join us in conversation tomorrow! YOU be there! 🙂 God has already put the deep love of Jesus in my heart for you. It’s going to be alright! He’s got you!

    Your loving brother in Christ,

  • Howdy Skywalker, Well, that’s the rascal side of me. I like to lighten things up a bit at times. Hope Angelgirl wasn’t upset. Now if she can cook and fish then we are definitely equally yoked! I figured that, based on her eloquent response, she had to have issues with denominational doctrine. There is no way that foundational doctrine can be the problem. I am waiting for Geoff to get another new post about ufos or hybrids. I was told that CBS news had a report that the hybrids are now walking among us and I have to concur. I have seen some interesting stuff on youtube that is genuinely real and not edited in any way. Hope Geoff can find that report and post it. Then this site will really be fun…and I DO like to have fun! Bless you my brother. In CHRIST Always, BuffaloBilly

  • Betty p

    Ministers like this are misleading people everyday. These people know God is love but He is also a God of wrath and judgement. If you do not teach the whole Bible then you need to get out of the pulpit. He is leading people to hell. I know a lot of people will not agree but the Bible teaches about false prophets and I believe he is one.

  • Howdy Emery, well, we will still disagree. True, I cannot lay claim to the apparent exhaustive study that you have done, but I have read the studies of others whom I have vetted and trust. The examples that you offer are more like exercises in semantics rather than the gross errors that you try to denote…and I’ll bet that YOUR bible doesn’t have any of those errors. The god that you serve really wrote his bible in the 19th century. The GOD that I serve and obey began the writing of HIS WORD close to 5,000 years ago. Again, GOD has answered “umpteens” of my prayers based on the reading of the KJV and has manifested HIMSELF in my life many, many times…and HE continually sends me confirmation that I am in HIS will. Your whole argument is based on Man’s mistakes; my whole argument is what GOD has done for me from HIS “mistake-ridden” WORD that blesses and preserves me. I have had muslims come to me to point out errors in the KJV Bible and all their efforts are fruitless because they don’t know how to read it and understand it…and I take the time to point that out to them. They don’t care because they are in bondage to the devil that they serve. AND…who are all these anointed people you claim to know and praise? I suppose the 144,000 Hebrews from the 12 tribes are not in YOUR bible because they have been cleverly written out and replaced with “witnesses”. I’m sorry, Emery, and I’m not being mean, but that dog simply won’t hunt. Respectfully, BuffaloBilly

  • Pingback: Joel Osteen Makes No Apology For His Refusal To Preach On Hell Or Other Bible Doctrines – Conspiracy Realism()

  • Engr. Nelson

    Hi, guys! I’m sorry for my delayed response-been swamped up in my books, preparing for some professional exams. Skywatcher, DC and BuffaloBilly, it would take a lot more than just a few words to express my innermost gratitude for the time and attention you guys have given me. I may not know any of you personally, but I see love in your hearts. And I feel so loved right now. Thanks once again.
    I think God led me to this site to meet with you guys; I’ve never come across people who seem to have such a grip of the WORD like you do. I went through each one of your posts more than twice. In my lifelong search for the “truth”, never have I had such robust and convincing answers. I was speaking with a friend last night and again we went through your posts together; she says she’d like to meet with you guys, too. I think the devil has finally lost his hold on my life. You’ve done more than justice to my questions, and I keep going through your responses, to have them all up in my head.
    You’re right, no earthly joy can be compared to that which you have when you are in Christ. Ever since I backslided, I haven’t had such inner peace like I had when I newly got born again. Yesterday I rededicated my life to God, never to go back to the world- well I wasn’t really in the world, but still I had lost my faith. You wouldn’t believe I’m a gospel celebrity here in Nigeria. I minister in songs to others and they get blessed; yet I’ve harbored these doubts for years. All I need now is to cultivate a working relationship with HIM.
    DC ma’am, I believe you’re old enough to be my mother and you have all the experience to guide me through. As you advised, I’ve begun reading the book of John, but there are yet areas I’m hazy about. I think I might need other Christian books to supplement. Also, I’ve downloaded the song you suggested. Please I’d like to get in touch.
    BuffaloBilly sir, your comment was the first I read and my heart melted thereafter. I’m completely convinced that you’re on the right path and I want to be like you, especially in the area of studying, as you’re obviously an addent student of the Bible. I wish to devote more time now to searching the Scriptures as I do my professional life. I want to be able to defend the gospel like you and Skywatcher did with the Jehovah’s witness. I think it’s the surest way of not going back to my old self. I want you to be my friend, as there’s a lot I can tap from you. Thanks for your time.
    Skywatcher, I’m sure it took you hours to compose that piece. I’ve read through it like four times. You cleared every doubt I had. And I want to assure you that your effort is not wasted. I’d like to be your friend also. It’s good to have friends like you guys around, so I can easily get across if there are other questions I might have. I’m just in my late twenties and I’m sure you’re either up to an elder brother or a father. You’ve all blessed my life and I can’t thank you enough. Aunty DC, BuffaloBilly and Skywatcher, I’m now your convert.

    • Larry/vietnamvet1971

      I agree, I read all the comments and they Skywatcher, DC BuffaloBilly, Edwitness, Ron (Sorry if I missed other) know the Word of GOD and they handle it with Honor and up lift, encourage myself…

      Keep up the good word in Truth & Honor.

      • Skywatcher

        Thank you, Brother Larry! Always glad to be of service! It’s always a pleasure to be in the service of the King of kings and Lord of lords! You know that! 🙂 God bless you, Bro!

    • DC

      I’m so glad to hear you are doing well.
      Yes, I could be your mama; I’m 51 and my boys will be 29 & 24 this summer. I am now a grandma, which got me thinking.

      This new baby girl doesn’t even know yet how much she is loved! She doesn’t do ANYTHING to contribute to the mortgage, the chores, the groceries, or society. Still her parents (and grandma) would lay down their lives for her. Her every need is met, from feedings, to diaper changes, to rocking her when she’s tired. (Grandma will not let her cry and is told she picks her up too much, but it’s a grandma’s job to spoil!) She is already a good baby who smiles and laughs and acts silly. BUT no matter how GOOD she is, it doesn’t have anything to do with how much she is loved. It won’t make us love her MORE. We love her because of who she is–a part her mama and my son, and also a part of me.

      When she is a toddler, what we call the “terrible twos,” she will discover her independence. She will quickly hate hearing the word “no” but love saying “no” when her mama wants her to have a bath or go to bed! She might be a sassy teenager when she’s older. BUT no matter how NAUGHTY she gets or even if she makes some mistakes, it won’t make her family love her any LESS.
      She cannot EARN our love, and she cannot LOSE our love.

      That’s how it is with our Heavenly Father. We have nothing to offer God but our faith. He has everything He needs and loves us no matter how much good we do or how much bad. He sent His Son to lay down His life for us! We cannot EARN His love because we already have it. We cannot LOSE His love because we are a part of Him and to hate us would be to hate Himself. ” Sometimes He does let us suffer a little for our choices because “whom the Lord loveth He chasteneth” (read Hebrews 12:6-11 for whole lesson.) Oh, did I suffer for my choices, and He STILL blessed me with beautiful children and now this little one.

      All of us are helpless babes in this world. We need to be totally dependent on God like that baby is totally dependent on her parents. Sometimes we do good because we want to please God, but it’s not to earn Heaven; we only need to admit we are a sinner and have faith in Jesus’ Sacrifice for our sin for that. Likewise, sometimes we are bad, rebellious even, and get consequences, but we NEVER lose God’s love. (I often cried when I had to discipline my children, even though it was a lesson they had to learn, but oh, what a joy to tell that child you still love him, hug him, and have the relationship restored, just like when we ask God for forgiveness!)

      I think that’s why Jesus said to have faith like a child! It’s when we try to do it all on our own that we find trouble. Imagine the pain, as a parent, if your children never talked to you and went their own way—like the Prodigal Son. Then the child comes home and you welcome him with open arms. We’ve all been Prodigals at one time or another. Your story is very common. But never forget that the Father awaits our return and repentance and will fully restore us to Himself. No matter how many times we turn away, He will always take us back! What a wonderful God He is!

  • Engr. Nelson

    Skywatcher, you could simply address me as Nelson. You know back here, we go by our titles all the time because not so many of us are educated, as opposed to what’s obtainable in your society. Yes, I’m born again, or at least I was before I backslideded. But talking to you guys has actually rejuvenated my faith. Sorry I didn’t show up as planned, but I’m here now. We could hook up possibly on WhatsApp or other media. I really do appreciate.

  • Skywatcher

    Whooo Hoooo! A rededication to Christ! YEEESSSSS!!!! (Wildly pumping my arm up and down in victory!) 🙂

    Hear that fellow siblings, in Christ?! That’s another victory for Team Jesus! Praise His most wonderful, matchless and powerful name!!!!!!!! This is what we’re all called to do!

    Nelson! So good to hear from you brother! You’ve blessed me “beyond words”! Yes, this thing called “Life” does get in the way sometimes, as we all do get busy. Thank God though, you’re studying to better yourself and to increase job opportunities! It’s good to be busy sometimes, as I grew up, I was told, “idle hands are the devil’s workshop”. It’s just so good to hear from you!

    Thank you, for the compliment! Yes, it took me several hours to write, but YOU are well worth it! It’s all Gods doing! He led you to the well, and a number of us have helped to pour some water of eternal life into your near-empty cup. If it weren’t for the love and grace of Jesus Christ, I would be nothing and backsliding too! So glad we could be of help to you, and glad to hear that your faith has been rejuvenated! That’s a great start, and I’m simply ecstatic for you! You’ve been in my heart and in my prayers each day since I first heard from you, and God has answered them…as USUAL! What a blessing your report has been to me today. My eyes tear up, knowing I had a small part to play in a lost lamb finding his way back to the Great Shepherd! By the way, you’re not my “convert”; You’re my brother in Christ and I’m your friend and brother too!

    I am old enough to be your father; 57 years young, and I can still outrun many 20 yr. olds! Yes, I can! Maybe not Nigerians, but the lazy slothful types we have around here! I have two daughters your age, who still need Jesus. I’m happy to assist you in any way that I can.

    Backsliding is so easy to do, and we all do it from time to time, not intentionally, but bit by bit, and before you know it, our love and relationship has cooled off. We allow the guard to come down first in one area of our life, and then another, and before you know it, the walls are all down, and the mat has been pulled out from under our feet, and we’ve drifted away! The old devil’s imps are pretty slick, BUT Jesus’s love and grace is more powerful and wiser!

    The part about your experience that greatly encourages me is the fact that you still had a concern in your heart about your walk with the Lord!!! That’s key evidence that you have not fallen from grace and are NOT lost! Where there’s a spark, there’s potential for a blazing inferno of faith, devotion, and service! When the concern about one’s relationship with Christ is gone, so is the relationship.

    You said, “I think the devil has finally lost his hold on my life.”

    Believe it, Bro! However, remember.. he’s like a roaring lion, roaming to and fro, seeking whom he may devour,I Pet. 5: 8, so always be on your guard! The closer you draw to Christ, the less his hold will be upon you. The more you take time to praise and to worship your Savior, the more Satan will have to withdraw and flee! After all, in Satan’s sick twisted little mind, it’s all about him, or he won’t stick around! When it’s all about HIM (Christ) in our lives, He’ll never leave or forsake you, Heb. 13: 5.

    Nelson, please allow me to encourage you to talk with Christ as though He’s sitting in the chair right next to you! Talk to Him like He is in the same room with you, because He is! When He’s in your heart, He’s everywhere you go! You’re never alone! So, don’t be afraid to speak out loud to Him (when appropriate to do so), and to talk to Him…friend to friend…creation to Almighty Creator! You’ll be glad you did!

    I don’t “do” any other form of media, but if you and/or your friend like to talk to me to get more encouragement, here is my email address: It’s probably not a smart thing to do this, but it’s for the Lord, and so far, I’ve not had any bad repercussions from it, and have helped several people. In reference to your friend, you said, “…she says she’d like to meet with you guys, too.” That brought a smile, because if she knows Jesus too, she will meet with us “guys” sooner than she can dare think!

    Here’s a tidy little word of encouragement, “Glimpse at your circumstances, but STARE AT the Savior! I look forward to hearing from you, little Brother! I’m so happy for you! God bless you, and your friend!

  • It may be true that Joel Osteen does not preach about hell. That is unfortunate. I am no defender of Joel Osteen, but it is one thing not to preach on the subject of hell and quite another to preach a distorted version of it. Evangelical Christians have for years distorted the subject of the judgment of God, and concocted a warped and fallacious version of the gospel based almost entirely on religious affiliation: Christians go to heaven, non-Christians go to hell. The Bible, on the other hand, does not make such a neat and tidy distinction (despite the urgent need to “believe in Jesus”). Rather, it is the WICKED who go to hell, whether they profess belief in Jesus Christ or not, and God has mercy on the ignorant (“Forgive them Father for they know not what they do”). Hell is not the penalty for human weakness (which is what the church often targets with its diatribes about ‘sin’) but for deep wilful rebellion against the love of God (which is the true definition of ‘sin’).

    Mercy triumphs over judgment, as the letter of James states, but judgment is without mercy to those who have shown no mercy. No mention here of the critical factor of ‘Christianity’. In Revelation we read that the water of life is given FREELY (i.e. no religious conditions attached) to those who thirst. “God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble” (so a humble person who has died with not quite the right set of doctrines in his mind, is shown grace, while the proud but punctiliously orthodox Christian is resisted). Matthew chapter 25 makes clear that compassion towards the needy is the factor that distinguishes the sheep from the goats. No amount of “profession of faith in Jesus” will save the person who is uncompassionate, proud, unmerciful and hard-hearted (“Many on that day will call me ‘Lord, Lord’…”)

    Perhaps when the evangelical churches start preaching about hell on a proper biblical basis, and actually take real evil seriously (to purge it from its own midst), then it would have some justification to criticise the likes of Mr Osteen. But not before…

    • Emery

      Mr. Graham;
      A quote from your post: “Christians go to heaven, non-Christians go to hell. ”
      No where in the inspired word of God can those two statements be found. They are not scriptural teachings. They are the teachings of men and of religion, not the teachings of God.

    • Howdy Allistair, Perhaps I can refer you to John 14:6. You might also want to reinspect your own theology which seems fraught with error. I won’t disagree about the teachings of today’s pastors as I have a problem-scripturally- with them. But I will tell you, unless you have JESUS as your own personal LORD and SAVIOR, obey HIM, and make sure that HE knows you, then you my friend will get a first-hand taste of what hell is and will surely be without excuse when you come before the Great GOD of the Universe at the Great White Throne Judgment. Sorry for being so blunt…but that really is the truth of the matter. Blessings, BuffaloBilly

      • Emery

        Are you attempting to say that we must only obey the commands Jesus brought to us? Are we to ignore the command to obey all of God’s commands? Are you aware of what the inspired word of God says about that, and about hell, and about the condition of the dead? It appears that you know what religions teach about it, but not what God’s word says about those subjects.

        • Howdy Emery, I think that we have been through before. JESUS says,”Why call ye me LORD, LORD and not do as I say”. So, yes, we are to obey JESUS. JESUS is GOD…”I and the FATHER are ONE” so we are also obeying all of GOD’S commandments. I am very aware of what the inspired WORD of MY GOD teaches, Emery; and I am not interested in what your god teaches. As I said, we have been through this before. I won’t change as I know in WHOM I believe. Thanks for your input…I guess… BuffaloBilly

          • Emery

            God’s word does not say Jesus is God. In fact, it says Jesus is God’s only begotten son. Look up the word beget. It says the Father is greater than Jesus. It says Jesus prayed to the Father, was sent by the Father, and that Jesus does his Father’s will, and not his own. If Jesus were God, more than half the scriptures would be completely wrong.

  • Emery, Your bible denies the trinity. Your bible says that JESUS and GOD are separate. I don’t buy what your bible says because, to me, it is a perversion of the KJV and I really don’t care how much time you have invested in your studies. They only prove to validate your bible and the jehovah’s witnesses of which I am not one nor ever shall be one. All your studies were to disprove the KJV and validate your bible…nothing more. Of course there are errors because they conflict with your beliefs. As I told you before–we’ve been through this and you, my friend, are in for a big surprise from your god. Please don’t bother me with any more of your nonsense as you have no argument for me or with me. Thanks in advance, BuffaloBilly

    • Emery

      Every translation does not support the myth of the trinity doctrine found in false religion and pagandom. All say the same things. And you make a claim about my studies that you could not possibly know, and can only guess at. Incorrectly, I might add. The errors in the KJV and most all other translations are real, deliberately inserted errors, put there by apostates like King James the First. None compare accurately to any of the 5,000 existing ancient scrolls and texts. I am in for no surprise from God. I know accurately what His inspired word says, and have known for almost 45 years. I’ve compared them for that length of time to the ancient scrolls. The KJV in particular was created using no original translatin efforts, but copying the works of others, to beat the completion of the Douhay Rheims by one year. And the thees and thous in the KJV were already outdated by about 200 years, when James had it produced. Those terms never appeared in any ancient Hebrew or ancient Koine Greek texts. Old English post dates the writing of the scriptures by a very long time.

    • Emery

      You said “your Bible”. I have 55 translations. Are you saying that they all deny the trinity? Well, you are correct in that statement. All of them do not support a trinity doctrine, and all support the fact that Jesus is God’s firstborn son, the only begotten son of God the Almighty. Half of them support the fact that hell is nothing more than the common grave of man, and all support the non-existence of an immortal soul. My beliefs do not conflict with God’s inspired word, since that is what I believe, the inspired word of God. I do not believe what any religion teaches, as they all teach things not found in God’s word, and no two religions teach the same thing. All of my 45 years of study were to determine exactly what God origionally said to us, not to disprove anything. Your claim that you know what’s in my head is nothing short of absurd Billy. Nothing God has in store for His faithful spiritual Israel and those who support spiritual Israel will ever be a “surprise”. He explained everything to us. Remember that Satan has veiled the truth of the scriptures, and only God can unveil them to us, IF He sees in us an honest hearted desire to know Him and His word, as He searches the hearts of everyone, all the time. He is searching for ones to honestly and righteously worship Him. And Billy, I have NEVER posted ANY nonsense in any way, shape, or form, ever. I have posted absolutely nothing but the truth found in the inspired word of God. The problem is that you do not know what His word says, and you have no desire to KNOW what His word says, for some suicidal reason only you know.

  • Emery, Give it a rest. This dialogue is futile and a waste of my time I’ll ignore any future posts from you. Sorry, but you have nothing of interest for me. I will honor Proverbs 14:7, 12; 18:7. Enjoy your life on earth.

  • Engr. Nelson

    DC ma’am, thank you so much. Don’t know if I could get a mail from you. I’m at There are some personal issues I wanna share with you.

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  • DC

    I am wondering if we are losing another pastor to prosperity teaching. I like John Hagee on End Times teaching, his outrage of what’s happened to our nation, and his support for Israel. However, about 6 mos. ago he had an event with Joel Osteen and got a LOT of flak for it on fb. I don’t have an account with fb but could read the comments. As of this past week, when I visit a public page I can no longer read what people are saying, so I’m asking you:

    John Hagee Ministries
    April 20 at 4:47am ·
    This coming Sunday, I will begin a three-part Bible teaching series on “God’s Plan for Your Prosperity.” From Genesis to Revelation, God charts a clear path for the prosperity of the righteous.
    In the Bible, God’s children have traditionally been wealthy. The Bible says of Abraham in Genesis 13:2, “Abraham was very rich in cattle, and in silver and gold.” Four thousand years later, in 2016, those are still very good investments to have.
    We are going to open the Bible and show you God’s plan for your prosperity. This is nothing more or less than a call to obey the Word of God. It is in fact your opportunity to prosper through obedience. God Himself guarantees it…all that’s required is your obedience (Deuteronomy 28:1-2).
    I look forward to seeing you Sunday as we begin a three-week discovery of the unsearchable riches of God’s Word. For our online church family, watch this sermon series LIVE on GETV.ORG at 8:30 AM and 11:00 AM CT. – Pastor John Hagee


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